From mjcal77 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 1 22:05:50 2017 From: mjcal77 at yahoo.com (CL in NC) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2017 02:05:50 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [AMRadio] Tech info for some mow dern stuff. References: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254@mail.yahoo.com> Passing this along from K4MQG in case you have something modern along with your vintage. de W4MEC Text follows: HI all, I just finished repairing a new IC-7600 radio for a customer. When you want to attach an external device so you can run an amplifier; RTTY; or other Digital modes, you need to know that, Icom; Yaesu; and probably Kenwood have run A+ to one pin (Icom pin 7) on the DIN ACC1 jack on the back of your radio. A+ is defined as the 13.8VDC at its full 20+ amp level. When this pin is accidentally shorted then the full 20 amp power supply current will find its way back to your power supply Burning up the small traces and components along the way. I have had this happen to Yaesu radios recently. Fortunately in the IC-7600 they designed in a 5 amp blade fuse supplying low level circuit current, However; that 5 amp level still burned up SMT components and Printed board traces along the way, heading back to the power supply Or in this case back to the 5 amp fuse first. The manufacturer should have protected that A+ (back at the connector) at a much safer level of current, so it would not burn things up When it is shorted. The moral is: think through several times every wire you plan to hook up to your radio before you hook them up. Mistakes will be costly now or down the road. This also applies to putting the wrong microphone on your radio because they run voltages out onto a mic pin these days. Of course Yaesu; Kenwood; ICOM; all use different pins on the same connector. Groan! :( A word to the wise. HI 73?s From ranchorobbo at gmail.com Wed Aug 2 05:51:07 2017 From: ranchorobbo at gmail.com (Rob Atkinson) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2017 04:51:07 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Tech info for some mow dern stuff. In-Reply-To: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254@mail.yahoo.com> References: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <885256960.5207655.1501639550254@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Tue, Aug 1, 2017 at 9:05 PM, CL in NC via AMRadio wrote: > Passing this along from K4MQG in case you have something modern along with your vintage. de W4MEC > > Text follows: > HI all, > I just finished repairing a new IC-7600 radio for a customer. > Ain't this a great reason for never buying a plastic radio? 73 Rob K5UJ From donroden at hiwaay.net Wed Aug 2 08:53:26 2017 From: donroden at hiwaay.net (donroden at hiwaay.net) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2017 07:53:26 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Tech info for some mow dern stuff. In-Reply-To: References: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <885256960.5207655.1501639550254@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20170802075326.Horde.gApgM_V7JWkFuV1GRJxbRYg@webmail.hiwaay.net> The Kenwood TS-2000 has a "real" amp relay, but I always advise running a external interface relay to keep the bad stuff, ( think unmodified SB-220 ) Don W4DNR Quoting Rob Atkinson : > On Tue, Aug 1, 2017 at 9:05 PM, CL in NC via AMRadio > wrote: >> Passing this along from K4MQG in case you have something modern >> along with your vintage. de W4MEC >> >> Text follows: > >> HI all, > >> I just finished repairing a new IC-7600 radio for a customer. >> > > Ain't this a great reason for never buying a plastic radio? > > 73 > > Rob > K5UJ > ______________________________________________________________ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to donroden at hiwaay.net DonR From ars.w5omr at gmail.com Wed Aug 2 11:32:11 2017 From: ars.w5omr at gmail.com (ARS W5OMR) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2017 10:32:11 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Tech info for some mow dern stuff. In-Reply-To: <20170802075326.Horde.gApgM_V7JWkFuV1GRJxbRYg@webmail.hiwaay.net> References: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <885256960.5207655.1501639550254@mail.yahoo.com> <20170802075326.Horde.gApgM_V7JWkFuV1GRJxbRYg@webmail.hiwaay.net> Message-ID: On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 7:53 AM, wrote: > The Kenwood TS-2000 has a "real" amp relay, but I always advise running a > external interface relay to keep the bad stuff, ( think unmodified SB-220 ) > ?The TS-2000 is 'locked' at 25w output on AM. In order for it to look 'decent' on a 'scope, the output has to be dropped to around 7 or 8 watts. ? ?Others in the TS- line-up, have separate Power Output and Carrier controls. The TS-2k does, as well, but as I said, it's -locked- at 25w output, Total. On, say, a TS-450S, the power output can be left at 100w (WFO) and the carrier brought down to around 25% of total output, for a decent looking audio pattern on an o'scope. Doesn't take much of a genius to see that 25w of carrier output is 4x 6.25w. I *like* the TS-2000 - it truly is a 'Shack-in-a-box', as far as a SSB/CW/FM xcvr is concerned - bonus is having 6m, 2m, and 70cm and all-mode too boot! But, it ain't no AM rig... unless you can tickle a quad of 6146's to drive a 4-1000 or a pair of 3-500Z's, if you're going to use a linear amplifier behind a plastic radio, as inefficient as that is.? -- Operating your AM rig without a scope is like driving our car at night without headlights. (~K4KYV) 73 = Best Regards, -Geoff/W5OMR From k4kyv at charter.net Wed Aug 2 14:26:28 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2017 13:26:28 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Tech info for some mow dern stuff. In-Reply-To: References: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <885256960.5207655.1501639550254@mail.yahoo.com> <20170802075326.Horde.gApgM_V7JWkFuV1GRJxbRYg@webmail.hiwaay.net> Message-ID: <001501d30bbc$db696130$923c2390$@charter.net> > ?The TS-2000 is 'locked' at 25w output on AM. > In order for it to look 'decent' on a 'scope, the output has to be dropped to > around 7 or 8 watts. Is that the maximum rf output capability of the final amp, or does it put out more than that with other modes? Maybe the manufacturers were worried about the final transistors overheating at 100% AM duty cycle beyond that power level. ? > But, it ain't no AM rig... unless you can tickle a quad of 6146's to drive a 4-1000 > or a pair of 3-500Z's, if you're going to use a linear amplifier behind a plastic > radio, as inefficient as that is.? The best way to use a plastic radio for AM is to disable the audio completely or else cut the af gain back to minimum, run it at reduced carrier and use it as a VFO to drive a plate-modulated transmitter. If it has enough carrier output capability at 100% duty cycle, it may be able to drive the final directly without a separate driver stage, particularly if the final is a tetrode or pentode. Don k4kyv --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From ne1s at securespeed.us Wed Aug 2 14:37:57 2017 From: ne1s at securespeed.us (Larry Szendrei) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2017 14:37:57 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Tech info for some mow dern stuff. In-Reply-To: <001501d30bbc$db696130$923c2390$@charter.net> References: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <885256960.5207655.1501639550254@mail.yahoo.com> <20170802075326.Horde.gApgM_V7JWkFuV1GRJxbRYg@webmail.hiwaay.net> <001501d30bbc$db696130$923c2390$@charter.net> Message-ID: On 8/2/17 2:26 PM, Donald Chester wrote: > The best way to use a plastic radio for AM is to disable the audio completely or else cut the af gain back to minimum, run it at reduced carrier and use it as a VFO to drive a plate-modulated transmitter. If it has enough carrier output capability at 100% duty cycle, it may be able to drive the final directly without a separate driver stage, particularly if the final is a tetrode or pentode. > That's what I do with my legal-limit PDM AM rig - a Kenmore TS-440 is the RF exciter driving the tetrode class C final grids with ~35W. They wouldn't need that much except I have the grid circuit loaded with some non-X R. 73, -Larry/NE1S From randyn3lrx at gmail.com Wed Aug 2 14:46:06 2017 From: randyn3lrx at gmail.com (Randy Berry) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2017 14:46:06 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Tech info for some mow dern stuff. In-Reply-To: References: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <885256960.5207655.1501639550254@mail.yahoo.com> <20170802075326.Horde.gApgM_V7JWkFuV1GRJxbRYg@webmail.hiwaay.net> <001501d30bbc$db696130$923c2390$@charter.net> Message-ID: My Plastic Radio is a K7DYY Super Senior. It might be modern but at least it's a REAL AM transmitter, and legal limit out of the box. I tried to build a Class E transmitter but that project is still in pieces. in my closet. I'd love to build a big bottle rig one day when I have the space to do it. 73 es gl de Randy N3LRX On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 2:37 PM, Larry Szendrei wrote: > On 8/2/17 2:26 PM, Donald Chester wrote: >> >> The best way to use a plastic radio for AM is to disable the audio >> completely or else cut the af gain back to minimum, run it at reduced >> carrier and use it as a VFO to drive a plate-modulated transmitter. If it >> has enough carrier output capability at 100% duty cycle, it may be able to >> drive the final directly without a separate driver stage, particularly if >> the final is a tetrode or pentode. >> > That's what I do with my legal-limit PDM AM rig - a Kenmore TS-440 is the RF > exciter driving the tetrode class C final grids with ~35W. They wouldn't > need that much except I have the grid circuit loaded with some non-X R. > > 73, > -Larry/NE1S > ______________________________________________________________ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to randyn3lrx at gmail.com From w5jo at brightok.net Wed Aug 2 16:11:43 2017 From: w5jo at brightok.net (w5jo at brightok.net) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2017 15:11:43 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Parts Message-ID: <8D1DC57626FD4109B93711BA93F50D31@JimPC> Does anyone have a SX-42 that is good for parts? At the moment I have identified one side of the audio transformer is open. Is there one available here or do I need to have this one rewound? Ye gads, what did I get myself into at my age? Jim W5JO From ranchorobbo at gmail.com Wed Aug 2 16:16:21 2017 From: ranchorobbo at gmail.com (Rob Atkinson) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2017 15:16:21 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Parts In-Reply-To: <8D1DC57626FD4109B93711BA93F50D31@JimPC> References: <8D1DC57626FD4109B93711BA93F50D31@JimPC> Message-ID: it keeps you young. rob k5uj On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 3:11 PM, wrote: > Does anyone have a SX-42 that is good for parts? At the moment I have > identified one side of the audio transformer is open. Is there one > available here or do I need to have this one rewound? > > Ye gads, what did I get myself into at my age? > > Jim > W5JO From oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com Wed Aug 2 16:27:23 2017 From: oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com (Robert Bethman) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2017 20:27:23 +0000 Subject: [AMRadio] Tech info for some mow dern stuff. In-Reply-To: <001501d30bbc$db696130$923c2390$@charter.net> References: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <885256960.5207655.1501639550254@mail.yahoo.com> <20170802075326.Horde.gApgM_V7JWkFuV1GRJxbRYg@webmail.hiwaay.net> <001501d30bbc$db696130$923c2390$@charter.net> Message-ID: The TS-2000 will not tolerate its full SSB output on AM. The Solid state Amplifiers, such as the ALS-1306 will only take 10W AM from a TS-2000 to develop full legal output. That is why when I had to reduce the weight of rigs due to medical issues, I obtained a TS-2000 AND the ALS-1306. Between them neither needs tuning, and they work great together. The local club became the new home for the LK-500ZB. I can talk to anyone I wish with this setup. I've gotten into Alabama with no problem at all. Regards, N0DGN -----Original Message----- From: amradio-bounces at mailman.qth.net [mailto:amradio-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Donald Chester Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2017 2:26 PM To: amradio at mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Tech info for some mow dern stuff. > ?The TS-2000 is 'locked' at 25w output on AM. > In order for it to look 'decent' on a 'scope, the output has to be dropped to > around 7 or 8 watts. Is that the maximum rf output capability of the final amp, or does it put out more than that with other modes? Maybe the manufacturers were worried about the final transistors overheating at 100% AM duty cycle beyond that power level. ? > But, it ain't no AM rig... unless you can tickle a quad of 6146's to drive a 4-1000 > or a pair of 3-500Z's, if you're going to use a linear amplifier behind a plastic > radio, as inefficient as that is.? The best way to use a plastic radio for AM is to disable the audio completely or else cut the af gain back to minimum, run it at reduced carrier and use it as a VFO to drive a plate-modulated transmitter. If it has enough carrier output capability at 100% duty cycle, it may be able to drive the final directly without a separate driver stage, particularly if the final is a tetrode or pentode. Don k4kyv --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ______________________________________________________________ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com From oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com Wed Aug 2 17:32:04 2017 From: oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com (Robert Bethman) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2017 21:32:04 +0000 Subject: [AMRadio] Kenwood TS-2000 Message-ID: This model of Kenwood is not even remotely like the TS-930SAT. The TS-930SAT had a heavy duty heatsink across the entire rear panel. It also had two very good fans to cool the finals, and a electromechanical antenna tuner built-in. The TS-2000 has a very small heatsink, and has NO fan on the heatsink at all. There is one very small fan inside that cools the processor section. The TS-930SAT would easily drive a pair of 3-500Zs. The TS-2000 will NOT drive 3-500Zs. One needing legal output on all modes using the TS-2000 will need one of the solid state amplifiers that are available. My choice was the ALS-1306. It is no tune, covers 160 through 6 meters. It is a two piece amp with a separate 240V power supply. Regards, N0DGN A.R.S. N0DGN [ Licensed Since 1980 ] Bob USA RET. Callsign: WitchDoctor From paul at paulbaldock.com Wed Aug 2 20:49:26 2017 From: paul at paulbaldock.com (Paul Baldock) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2017 17:49:26 -0700 Subject: [AMRadio] Kenwood TS-2000 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <59827318.0f55650a.daacd.7809@mx.google.com> At 02:32 PM 8/2/2017, you wrote: > The TS-2000 will NOT drive 3-500Zs. The TS-2000 will, and does. The TS2000 can run 25Watts of AM all day. Assuming the 2 3-500Z's will run 1.5KPEP and 375W of carrier and has 13dB gain, then all you need is 18.75W. More typical would be to run the 2x3-500Z's at 1KW PEP, 250W of carrier and TS-2000 around 12.5W. BTW: The TS-2000 fan does blow across the heatsink. FYI The TS930 has 2 fans, one for the power supply and one for the finals. - Paul KW7Y - Paul From knjhanlon at msn.com Wed Aug 2 20:59:40 2017 From: knjhanlon at msn.com (JAMES HANLON) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2017 00:59:40 +0000 Subject: [AMRadio] Amazon scam In-Reply-To: <1548236858.4036353.1501536770870@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1548236858.4036353.1501536770870.ref@mail.yahoo.com>, <1548236858.4036353.1501536770870@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: My wife is an Amazon Prime member, and I can't find the notice in our inbox. Be careful! Jim, W8KGI ________________________________ From: CL in NC Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 3:32 PM To: amradio at mailman.qth.net Subject: [AMRadio] Amazon scam No legitimate website will ask you to verify anything through a link de W4MEC From donroden at hiwaay.net Wed Aug 2 21:08:24 2017 From: donroden at hiwaay.net (donroden at hiwaay.net) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2017 20:08:24 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Kenwood TS-2000 In-Reply-To: <59827318.0f55650a.daacd.7809@mx.google.com> References: <59827318.0f55650a.daacd.7809@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <20170802200824.Horde.lA8xe_E-yMlOvHh3Ao9pNNB@webmail.hiwaay.net> Quoting Paul Baldock : > BTW: The TS-2000 fan does blow across the heatsink. And the whole chassis is the heatsink. Excellent design. Don W4DNR DonR From ranchorobbo at gmail.com Thu Aug 3 06:16:19 2017 From: ranchorobbo at gmail.com (Rob Atkinson) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2017 05:16:19 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Tech info for some mow dern stuff. In-Reply-To: References: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <885256960.5207655.1501639550254@mail.yahoo.com> <20170802075326.Horde.gApgM_V7JWkFuV1GRJxbRYg@webmail.hiwaay.net> <001501d30bbc$db696130$923c2390$@charter.net> Message-ID: On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 1:46 PM, Randy Berry wrote: > My Plastic Radio is a K7DYY Super Senior. That's an AM rig. A plastic radio is a manufactured slopbucket transceiver, usually solid state and made off-shore after around 1980. The DYY rig, is a real AM rig, class D. a few broadcast transmitter manufacturers briefly made tube class D pulse width rigs in the 1980s. Continental made one that ran three 3-500Zs, two for the final PA and one to switch it on and off. > It might be modern but at > least it's a REAL AM transmitter, and legal limit out of the box. Depends on what you mean by "legal limit." > I tried to build a Class E transmitter but that project is still in > pieces. in my closet. I'd love to build a big bottle rig one day when > I have the space to do it. Good luck with the class E rig. Also hope you realize your dream of a tube maul. Once you go vacuum in a rack there's no retraction back. One look at hot glass and you'll give solid state a pass. 73 Rob K5UJ From donroden at hiwaay.net Thu Aug 3 09:29:08 2017 From: donroden at hiwaay.net (donroden at hiwaay.net) Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2017 08:29:08 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Tech info for some mow dern stuff. In-Reply-To: References: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <885256960.5207655.1501639550254@mail.yahoo.com> <20170802075326.Horde.gApgM_V7JWkFuV1GRJxbRYg@webmail.hiwaay.net> <001501d30bbc$db696130$923c2390$@charter.net> Message-ID: <20170803082908.Horde.DUwR-kX74TV6dY44PdkY7Gv@webmail.hiwaay.net> Messiner EX Signal Shifter Heathkit DX-40 Viking Valiant Bauer 707 Harris MW1A one KW AM transistor rig Harris SX1A and SX1 one KW FET class D pulse width Collins S-Line ( the whole set... mike to 30S1 ) 62S1 my first 2 meter SSB. worked a lot of OscarSats in the early 70s with that combo FT-747GX ... probably my favorite small plastic. It made me a lot of $$ as a signal generator in the AM Band tuning AM antennas and tuning units. nice little PSK-31 rig. Sounds good on AM. FT-767GX My first "DC to Daylight" transceiver. Nice sounding AM connects well to my CAT-1000 repeater controller as a remote base. Countless dual band mobiles ... even a Kenwood TR-751 2 meter SSB Mobile ( planned rover.. never implemented ) A pair of TS-2000s .... this radio does EVERYTHING ... maybe not as well as some radios on specific frequencies/modes but I still marvel at the design technology that went into this radio 18 years ago... SkyCommand with a walkie... beats the 767/CAT1000 combo hands down. I have enjoyed them all... I plan more AM operation with the broadcast rigs. ( or maybe the plastics with a 20db linear ) Like my dogs, once they come into the house ( ham shack ) they never leave. They are all worth more to me just sitting quietly waiting on me to decide just what to do than any $$ I might get from selling. And the garage has a 1957 Chevy and a 1969 Chevy in various stages of restoration.... I'm told it's a disease or mental defect.... hoarding. Maybe the kids can find a reputable auction house when I go SK. Don W4DNR Quoting Rob Atkinson : > On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 1:46 PM, Randy Berry wrote: >> My Plastic Radio is a K7DYY Super Senior. > > That's an AM rig. A plastic radio is a manufactured slopbucket > transceiver, usually solid state and made off-shore after around 1980. > The DYY rig, is a real AM rig, class D. a few broadcast transmitter > manufacturers briefly made tube class D pulse width rigs in the 1980s. > Continental made one that ran three 3-500Zs, two for the final PA and > one to switch it on and off. > >> It might be modern but at >> least it's a REAL AM transmitter, and legal limit out of the box. > > Depends on what you mean by "legal limit." > >> I tried to build a Class E transmitter but that project is still in >> pieces. in my closet. I'd love to build a big bottle rig one day when >> I have the space to do it. > > Good luck with the class E rig. Also hope you realize your dream of a > tube maul. > > Once you go vacuum in a rack there's no retraction back. One look at > hot glass and you'll give solid state a pass. > > 73 > > Rob > K5UJ > ______________________________________________________________ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to donroden at hiwaay.net DonR From randyn3lrx at gmail.com Thu Aug 3 10:22:48 2017 From: randyn3lrx at gmail.com (Randy Berry) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2017 10:22:48 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Tech info for some mow dern stuff. In-Reply-To: References: <885256960.5207655.1501639550254.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <885256960.5207655.1501639550254@mail.yahoo.com> <20170802075326.Horde.gApgM_V7JWkFuV1GRJxbRYg@webmail.hiwaay.net> <001501d30bbc$db696130$923c2390$@charter.net> Message-ID: I like My Super Sr. Mine's the original 160/80m version. Even though I'm afraid to run it up an more than 40 watts carrier which nobody hears me. I've tested it on the dummy load with a peak reading meter and it will do 400 watts carrier 1,500 watts pep. One of these days I'll get to use it to its fullest potential. Just not in this apartment. I just wish I had the funds to buy another one. This time the 80/40m version. Perhaps I'd have better luck with 40m in this apartment. My antenna consists of 2 75m HamSticks in a vertical dipole configuration on a 36" bar clamp that I clamp to my railing. I'd like to try 40m even 20m but I've talked to Bruce (K7DYY) about that and it's just not cost effective to make a 40m/20m Class D. The FETS are much more expensive and band switching becomes a nightmare. What you wind up with is a mono bander that costs as much as the dual banders. I may be forced to buy a plastic radio for the car and run mobile since I can't run fixed. I've considered an FT-857D for the car. 73 es gl de Randy N3LRX On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 6:16 AM, Rob Atkinson wrote: > On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 1:46 PM, Randy Berry wrote: >> My Plastic Radio is a K7DYY Super Senior. > > That's an AM rig. A plastic radio is a manufactured slopbucket > transceiver, usually solid state and made off-shore after around 1980. > The DYY rig, is a real AM rig, class D. a few broadcast transmitter > manufacturers briefly made tube class D pulse width rigs in the 1980s. > Continental made one that ran three 3-500Zs, two for the final PA and > one to switch it on and off. > >> It might be modern but at >> least it's a REAL AM transmitter, and legal limit out of the box. > > Depends on what you mean by "legal limit." > >> I tried to build a Class E transmitter but that project is still in >> pieces. in my closet. I'd love to build a big bottle rig one day when >> I have the space to do it. > > Good luck with the class E rig. Also hope you realize your dream of a > tube maul. > > Once you go vacuum in a rack there's no retraction back. One look at > hot glass and you'll give solid state a pass. > > 73 > > Rob > K5UJ From oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com Thu Aug 3 12:28:11 2017 From: oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com (Robert Bethman) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2017 16:28:11 +0000 Subject: [AMRadio] Kenwood TS-2000 Message-ID: 1. I never brought up the internal limit of 25 watts. 2. Yes, it *did* drive the Amp Supply LK-500ZB. However it still looked like junk on the monitor scope. No, I do not use a cheap scope! I happen to use a Rigol DS-1102E. 3. One must severely reduce the output on AM, AND dial the modulation way down to see a GOOD result on the monitoring scope. I refuse to transmit a sorry distorted signal. 4. I am well aware of the TS-930SAT internal fan structure. Had to replace both of those very cheap Mabuchi sleeve bushing fans. Replaced both with ball bearing PC CPU cooling fans, and reduced the power used by them. I chose to replace the Amp Supply LK-500ZB with a SS amplifier for multiple reasons. Heat in the shack, cost of replacing 3-500Zs, less weight to deal with since I now have an entire spine effected by Arthritis. Handling excessive weight is indeed very painful. [ I elected to simply state medical issues. ] Emptied entire shack of BC-610s over this issue alone. Moving 400lb beasts wasn't feasible any longer. Regards, N0DGN A.R.S. N0DGN [ Licensed Since 1980 ] Bob USA RET. Callsign: WitchDoctor From oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com Thu Aug 3 23:11:07 2017 From: oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com (Robert Bethman) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2017 03:11:07 +0000 Subject: [AMRadio] Ensuring the scope is well within limits of calibration Message-ID: I use a very good VXCO. I have additionally built a GPS Frequency Standard. [ GPSDO ] Designed by Mr. Wenzel! Uses a Trimble Resolution T Board with an active GPS Antenna that receives between 10 to 12 satellites at the minimum. This is how I keep from having to send my oscilloscope in to have it calibrated. I essentially maintain my own calibrating ability. Regards, N0DGN A.R.S. N0DGN [ Licensed Since 1980 ] Bob USA RET. Callsign: WitchDoctor From oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com Thu Aug 3 23:15:03 2017 From: oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com (Robert Bethman) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2017 03:15:03 +0000 Subject: [AMRadio] Minor edit Message-ID: Make that a VCXO. Although most should understand that it is indeed a voltage controlled crystal oscillator. A top of the line model. A.R.S. N0DGN [ Licensed Since 1980 ] Bob USA RET. Callsign: WitchDoctor From oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com Thu Aug 3 23:50:59 2017 From: oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com (Robert Bethman) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2017 03:50:59 +0000 Subject: [AMRadio] Two tone audio generation Message-ID: One could either make or purchase two XR2206 Signal Generator Module DIY Kit Output 1Hz-1MHz Adjustable Frequency A6Q9. It would most likely be cheaper to buy the kits rather than purchasing all the parts. I use my Rigol to set the two at 400Hz and 1KHz. combine the two signals. [ Pay attention to polarity! ] Feed them into a pretty small speaker. These signal generators must be impedance matched to the speaker! They output @ 600 ohm impedance. So work out what you need for what speaker impedance you have at hand. I use an acrylic tube with a few holes in it to allow for airflow yet don't pick up exterior noise. Decent open cell foam will work fine. Place the radio microphone inside the far end. Now you have a darn good two tone generator to feed the microphone with a signal that you have set the output level and frequencies. Observe the radio output with your monitor scope. [ Don't forget to use a dummy load! ] I have a 400 Watt one at hand. That will handle *most* exciters. Regards, N0DGN A.R.S. N0DGN [ Licensed Since 1980 ] Bob USA RET. Callsign: WitchDoctor From jcandela at prodigy.net Fri Aug 4 10:03:35 2017 From: jcandela at prodigy.net (Jim Candela) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2017 14:03:35 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [AMRadio] Two tone audio generation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <160175002.5722927.1501855415650@mail.yahoo.com> For a hardware based setup consider these options: Look at this:? (about 49 bucks USD) http://www.cumbriadesigns.co.uk/2-tone.htm ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Or this one from Elecraft for $69:http://www.elecraft.com/mini_module_kits/mini_modules.htm ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For a PC based version using the computer sound car, consider this free signal generator. Look for SigGenFreeware....For two tone, run two of them at the same time:http://www.dr-jordan-design.de/Downloads.htm JimWd5JKO From: Robert Bethman To: "AM Radio List (AMradio at mailman.qth.net)" Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 10:51 PM Subject: [AMRadio] Two tone audio generation One could either make or purchase two XR2206 Signal Generator Module DIY Kit Output 1Hz-1MHz Adjustable Frequency A6Q9. It would most likely be cheaper to buy the kits rather than purchasing all the parts. I use my Rigol to set the two at 400Hz and 1KHz.? combine the two signals.? [? Pay attention to polarity! ] Feed them into a pretty small speaker.? These signal generators must be impedance matched to the speaker!? They output @ 600 ohm impedance.? So work out what you need for what speaker impedance you have at hand. I use an acrylic tube with a few holes in it to allow for airflow yet don't pick up exterior noise.? Decent open cell foam will work fine. Place the radio microphone inside the far end. Now you have a darn good two tone generator to feed the microphone with a signal that you have set the output level and frequencies. Observe the radio output with your monitor scope.? [? Don't forget to use a dummy load!? ]? I have a 400 Watt one at hand.? That will handle *most* exciters.? Regards, N0DGN A.R.S. N0DGN [ Licensed Since 1980 ] Bob USA RET. Callsign: WitchDoctor ______________________________________________________________ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to jcandela at prodigy.net From jcandela at prodigy.net Fri Aug 4 10:17:16 2017 From: jcandela at prodigy.net (Jim Candela) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2017 14:17:16 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [AMRadio] Two tone audio generation In-Reply-To: <160175002.5722927.1501855415650@mail.yahoo.com> References: <160175002.5722927.1501855415650@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1279740021.5785176.1501856236491@mail.yahoo.com> Here are some plots of harmonic distortion, and IMD using my CE 20A on LSB, and then AM: Look at reply 14 here: http://amfone.net/Amforum/index.php?topic=42220.msg306551#msg306551 From w3slk at verizon.net Fri Aug 4 10:17:30 2017 From: w3slk at verizon.net (Mike Sawyer) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2017 10:17:30 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Two tone audio generation In-Reply-To: <160175002.5722927.1501855415650@mail.yahoo.com> References: <160175002.5722927.1501855415650@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <003d01d30d2c$6bee0740$43ca15c0$@verizon.net> What about the venerable Heathkit SB-610 scopes? Didn't they have an output for 400 Hz & 1000 Hz for doing these kinds of tests? Mod-U-Lator, Mike(y)/W3SLK From ranickel at comcast.net Fri Aug 4 11:05:51 2017 From: ranickel at comcast.net (Robert Nickels) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2017 10:05:51 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Two tone audio generation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Frequency Sound Generator" is a free app that allows you to dial up any combination of up 1, 2, or 3 tones, sine, square, or triangle wave - on an Android device. Plug a 3.5mm cable into the headphone jack and you're good to go. 73, Bob W9RAN From jcandela at prodigy.net Fri Aug 4 12:03:36 2017 From: jcandela at prodigy.net (Jim Candela) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2017 16:03:36 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [AMRadio] Two tone audio generation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <715499134.5825228.1501862616501@mail.yahoo.com> When doing distortion tests, be it harmonic, or intermodulation tests (2 tone), the audio source needs to be MUCH cleaner than the system being tested. That said, a super clean audio source that is hooked up in a way that introduces some hum, or has RF intrusion into the audio source will certainly "muddy up" the results. The audio source must be well shielded, and free of ground loops. Also, the RF issue can be minimized by using a good dummy load. Computer based audio sources can be very clean, and some not...A lot depends on the D-A and audio output circuitry (sound card). Some of the audio sources mentioned thus far will not be clean enough. The Cumbria and the Elecraft boards advertise -50db distortion (0.1%)...but those are raw boards with no shielding, or enclosure...The cumbria also has a single adjustable tone whereas the Elecraft only has two fixed tones. I have bought two XLOCK's from Cumbria, and they are a first class company with well engineered products. JimWd5JKO From oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com Fri Aug 4 12:44:18 2017 From: oldrotorheadsarge at outlook.com (Robert Bethman) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2017 16:44:18 +0000 Subject: [AMRadio] Two tone audio generation In-Reply-To: <160175002.5722927.1501855415650@mail.yahoo.com> References: <160175002.5722927.1501855415650@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Jim, I use these function generators for all sort of work. They run right around $10 on the Bay. They cover 1Hz to1MHZ. They are very useful and produce sine, triangle and square wave outputs. I obtained them already built, and in their own case. They use 9VDC to run them. I have a 30VDC 10A power source, and DC to DC adjustable voltage modules. I also have a bunch of 3 digit LED voltage meters that will read down to the 1/100th volt when running in the 9VDC range. They are powered by the power source when using a minimum of 2.7VDC. A handful of these ran $10 also. My only real expense has been the Rigol DS-1102E. It was worth everything invested. Reads up to 100MHZ, dual channel, full digital processing, and a display that gives voltage, frequency, and period on the display. I keep computers out of the shack. Mine are full tower systems with 25? HDMI Displays. I avoid RFI like the plague. Regards, N0DGN From: Jim Candela [mailto:jcandela at prodigy.net] Sent: Friday, August 04, 2017 10:04 AM To: Robert Bethman ; AM Radio List (AMradio at mailman.qth.net) Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Two tone audio generation For a hardware based setup consider these options: Look at this: (about 49 bucks USD) http://www.cumbriadesigns.co.uk/2-tone.htm ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Or this one from Elecraft for $69: http://www.elecraft.com/mini_module_kits/mini_modules.htm ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For a PC based version using the computer sound car, consider this free signal generator. Look for SigGenFreeware....For two tone, run two of them at the same time: http://www.dr-jordan-design.de/Downloads.htm Jim Wd5JKO ________________________________ From: Robert Bethman > To: "AM Radio List (AMradio at mailman.qth.net)" > Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 10:51 PM Subject: [AMRadio] Two tone audio generation One could either make or purchase two XR2206 Signal Generator Module DIY Kit Output 1Hz-1MHz Adjustable Frequency A6Q9. It would most likely be cheaper to buy the kits rather than purchasing all the parts. I use my Rigol to set the two at 400Hz and 1KHz. combine the two signals. [ Pay attention to polarity! ] Feed them into a pretty small speaker. These signal generators must be impedance matched to the speaker! They output @ 600 ohm impedance. So work out what you need for what speaker impedance you have at hand. I use an acrylic tube with a few holes in it to allow for airflow yet don't pick up exterior noise. Decent open cell foam will work fine. Place the radio microphone inside the far end. Now you have a darn good two tone generator to feed the microphone with a signal that you have set the output level and frequencies. Observe the radio output with your monitor scope. [ Don't forget to use a dummy load! ] I have a 400 Watt one at hand. That will handle *most* exciters. Regards, N0DGN A.R.S. N0DGN [ Licensed Since 1980 ] Bob USA RET. Callsign: WitchDoctor ______________________________________________________________ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to jcandela at prodigy.net From w5jv at hotmail.com Fri Aug 4 16:31:20 2017 From: w5jv at hotmail.com (Doug Hensley) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2017 20:31:20 +0000 Subject: [AMRadio] XR-2206 and the 2 Tone Oscillator Discussion Message-ID: I have two XR-2206 items on hand that I don't want. One is the XR2206 chip, the pc board & what looks like a small guide book (don't know if its a manual). The board has a couple of resistors mounted but that's all. The other item is a built-up XR-2206 Oscillator in cabinet with what looks like all the bells & whistles planned out. But it is untested. If anyone is interested, I'll be happy to send pictures. In return, you tell me what you would offer for either or both. Cheers, Doug W5JV From ne1s at securespeed.us Sat Aug 5 18:31:58 2017 From: ne1s at securespeed.us (Larry Szendrei) Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2017 18:31:58 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Fwd: HR555 and antennas In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <793b1e23-cfc1-e1e2-08fa-53d1d95476b0@securespeed.us> This is worth reading and following with appropriate action. To me it sounds like a classic case of "be careful what you wish for." Bry gave me permission/encouragement to forward it to these lists. 73, -Larry/NE1S -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: [Glowbugs] HR555 and antennas Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2017 18:18:10 +0000 From: Bry Carling To: tetrode Glowbugs /The future is that time when you'll wish you'd done/ / what you aren't doing now./ On Wednesday, August 2, 2017 5:52 PM, Marty Woll wrote: Now that I am a former ARRL Vice Director, I am free to speak my mind on this matter. As a long-time proponent of antenna rights, it is with great disappointment that I say I do not favor passage of HR-555. I should add up front, by way of disclaimer, that I am not an attorney. I was a big supporter of the original Amateur Radio Parity Act - the PRB-1 version. The ability to put up outdoor antennas and the structures necessary to support them on your property is crucial to being an active Ham for many licensees. Since 2010 I have visited the offices of numerous elected officials, sent over a thousand e-mail messages, spent entire convention weekends generating letters from Hams to their elected representatives and spoken at countless club meetings to drum up support for this legislation. It's fair to say that I invested a major chunk of my time in support of the original Parity Act, and I certainly respect ARRL leadership for its persistence in seeking relief for all impacted Amateurs, whether League members or not. However, in February of 2016 the language that mirrored PRB-1 was removed from HR-1301 (now HR-555), and this is a critique of the result, not of the intent or effort. Last year, ARRL found itself at odds with one senator over the bill and was required to negotiate compromise language with CAI, a national trade association of homeowner associations (HOAs) and similar groups. While I had some major misgivings at the time, I did not object to the compromise language because I believed it would help at least those Amateurs who live in homes with developer-imposed deed restrictions not within the purview of an active HOA. Since that time, however, some high-profile, competent and very knowledgeable attorneys (all of them Hams but none associated with the ARRL Board) have evaluated the compromise language and found that it may do more harm than good. They have pointed out some serious shortcomings in HR-555 that significantly restrict how many Hams may benefit from its passage and that, if uncorrected, could actually diminish the rights of some Amateurs and grant the right to regulate Amateur antennas to HOAs that do not now have that right. What follows is an abbreviated description of the issues surrounding HR-555, the current version of the Parity Act. For those who want to dig deeper into the matter, I have a version I can e-mail you separately that include attachments containing (1) the original bill language, (2) the compromise language in the current bill, and (3) an analysis prepared by former FCC attorney and active Amateur Radio operator Jim Talens N3JT for the Potomac Valley Radio Club. Many of the points in Jim's critique were also made by Fred Hopengarten K1VR (author of Antenna Zoning for the Radio Amateur) at his presentation to the Legal Forum at the May 2017 Dayton Hamvention. Suffice it to say that the expert Ham-attorneys are NOT all lining up in support of HR-555 in its current form. The original bill pretty much paralleled PRB-1, the Federal Preemption Statute. It required the FCC to revise its regulations to prohibit private deed restrictions that preclude or fail to reasonably accommodate Amateur Radio communications or that do not constitute the minimum practicable restriction on such communications to accomplish the legitimate purpose of the private entity seeking to enforce such restriction. On the other hand, the compromise bill that CAI insisted on does the following: 1) It grants HOAs the right to use aesthetics as a basis for antenna decisions, even to those associations whose rules do not now have any provisions concerning antennas. This grant of power to HOAs is unprecedented in Federal law, and it adds a right - as a matter of Federal law - for HOA's that has never been previously approved in Federal law. That right cannot be undone by state law. 2) It requires a deed-restricted Amateur to notify and seek prior permission from the HOA before installing any outdoor antenna, with no grandfathering for those already installed. 3) It does not establish a time frame within which the HOA must render a decision; an HOA can stall indefinitely and do so without adverse consequence. 4) It does not grant or guarantee to an Amateur the right to operate on the band(s) of his or her choice. 5) It permits but does not require the HOA to establish written rules regarding antenna size, type and location. 6) It does not establish or require an HOA administrative process for redress if an HOA denies a Ham's requested antenna. The decision of the HOA is final. Under HR-555, if passed, Hams who have existing "stealth" antennas, even with the concurrence of their immediate neighbors, would now be in violation of Federal law and FCC regulations. HOAs will be legally able to write their own rules with no objective criteria and no standards, and they will have the unrestricted power of Federal law to back them up. The band(s) on which the Amateur wishes to operate need not be a consideration in any HOA decision; they could limit you to a small UHF whip a few inches long on your gutter and say that have accommodated Amateur Radio. An HOA that previously existed only to conduct limited activities, such as maintaining roads, utilities and exterior landscaping, one that has never held any power to regulate Amateur Radio, would be granted the power to demand the removal of existing antennas and to demand that an Amateur seek its approval to install any Amateur antennas or supports. Imagine having moved into a neighborhood because the HOA had no regulatory power over Amateur Radio antennas, only to have Federal law now grant the HOA that power! The compromise bill expressly disconnects itself from PRB-1. Unfortunately, that means that none of the Ham-friendly court decisions interpreting PRB-1 would be binding on an HOA. It has been argued that the FCC, in writing the regulations required by HR-555, could eliminate some of the above risks. However, the FCC has opposed restricting the rights of HOAs for over thirty years, and I don't think it is prudent to count on the Commission to reverse itself and interpret the law in our favor. Neither can we count on CAI, having won the rights it demanded, to sit by and make no attempt to influence the post-enactment regulatory process in its favor. Wishful thinking to the contrary is hardly a sound basis on which to make our decisions. Because of the aforementioned shortcomings of HR-555 and the likely adverse consequences of its passage, I cannot support it any longer. There may be a better path than the one the League is now pursuing; I don't know if we can ever get there, but I certainly don't want us to make things worse for a significant number of Amateurs or expose them to being found in violation of Federal law and FCC regulations. Please consider these points when you are asked to write letters of support for HR-555 to your legislators. As an aside, I want to remind you that some licensees have been successful in selling the advantages of Amateur Radio-based disaster communication capability to their HOA boards. Offering benefits can be much easier and less costly than demanding one's rights. 73, Marty N6VI -- -- ZCZC This is a transmission from the Glowbugs list To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tetrode+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/tetrode?hl=en NNNN --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Glowbugs" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to tetrode+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com . For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. From k4kyv at charter.net Sat Aug 5 20:36:32 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2017 19:36:32 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Fwd: HR555 and antennas In-Reply-To: <793b1e23-cfc1-e1e2-08fa-53d1d95476b0@securespeed.us> References: <793b1e23-cfc1-e1e2-08fa-53d1d95476b0@securespeed.us> Message-ID: <003201d30e4c$0d1eebf0$275cc3d0$@charter.net> > Last year, ARRL found itself at odds with one senator over the bill > and was required to negotiate compromise language with CAI, a national trade > association of homeowner associations (HOAs) and similar groups. No wonder CAI has dropped its objection to the legislation in its present form. It's worth noting that the HOAs have their own UNION! Here's a more readable version of the text; I cleaned up the distracting line breaks: On Wednesday, August 2, 2017 5:52 PM, Marty Woll wrote: Now that I am a former ARRL Vice Director, I am free to speak my mind on this matter. As a long-time proponent of antenna rights, it is with great disappointment that I say I do not favor passage of HR-555. I should add up front, by way of disclaimer, that I am not an attorney. I was a big supporter of the original Amateur Radio Parity Act - the PRB-1 version. The ability to put up outdoor antennas and the structures necessary to support them on your property is crucial to being an active Ham for many licensees. Since 2010 I have visited the offices of numerous elected officials, sent over a thousand e-mail messages, spent entire convention weekends generating letters from Hams to their elected representatives and spoken at countless club meetings to drum up support for this legislation. It's fair to say that I invested a major chunk of my time in support of the original Parity Act, and I certainly respect ARRL leadership for its persistence in seeking relief for all impacted Amateurs, whether League members or not. However, in February of 2016 the language that mirrored PRB-1 was removed from HR-1301 (now HR-555), and this is a critique of the result, not of the intent or effort. Last year, ARRL found itself at odds with one senator over the bill and was required to negotiate compromise language with CAI, a national trade association of homeowner associations (HOAs) and similar groups. While I had some major misgivings at the time, I did not object to the compromise language because I believed it would help at least those Amateurs who live in homes with developer-imposed deed restrictions not within the purview of an active HOA. Since that time, however, some high-profile, competent and very knowledgeable attorneys (all of them Hams but none associated with the ARRL Board) have evaluated the compromise language and found that it may do more harm than good. They have pointed out some serious shortcomings in HR-555 that significantly restrict how many Hams may benefit from its passage and that, if uncorrected, could actually diminish the rights of some Amateurs and grant the right to regulate Amateur antennas to HOAs that do not now have that right. What follows is an abbreviated description of the issues surrounding HR-555, the current version of the Parity Act. For those who want to dig deeper into the matter, I have a version I can e-mail you separately that include attachments containing (1) the original bill language, (2) the compromise language in the current bill, and (3) an analysis prepared by former FCC attorney and active Amateur Radio operator Jim Talens N3JT for the Potomac Valley Radio Club. Many of the points in Jim's critique were also made by Fred Hopengarten K1VR (author of Antenna Zoning for the Radio Amateur) at his presentation to the Legal Forum at the May 2017 Dayton Hamvention. Suffice it to say that the expert Ham-attorneys are NOT all lining up in support of HR-555 in its current form. The original bill pretty much paralleled PRB-1, the Federal Preemption Statute. It required the FCC to revise its regulations to prohibit private deed restrictions that preclude or fail to reasonably accommodate Amateur Radio communications or that do not constitute the minimum practicable restriction on such communications to accomplish the legitimate purpose of the private entity seeking to enforce such restriction. On the other hand, the compromise bill that CAI insisted on does the following: 1) It grants HOAs the right to use aesthetics as a basis for antenna decisions, even to those associations whose rules do not now have any provisions concerning antennas. This grant of power to HOAs is unprecedented in Federal law, and it adds a right - as a matter of Federal law - for HOA's that has never been previously approved in Federal law. That right cannot be undone by state law. 2) It requires a deed-restricted Amateur to notify and seek prior permission from the HOA before installing any outdoor antenna, with no grandfathering for those already installed. 3) It does not establish a time frame within which the HOA must render a decision; an HOA can stall indefinitely and do so without adverse consequence. 4) It does not grant or guarantee to an Amateur the right to operate on the band(s) of his or her choice. 5) It permits but does not require the HOA to establish written rules regarding antenna size, type and location. 6) It does not establish or require an HOA administrative process for redress if an HOA denies a Ham's requested antenna. The decision of the HOA is final. Under HR-555, if passed, Hams who have existing "stealth" antennas, even with the concurrence of their immediate neighbors, would now be in violation of Federal law and FCC regulations. HOAs will be legally able to write their own rules with no objective criteria and no standards, and they will have the unrestricted power of Federal law to back them up. The band(s) on which the Amateur wishes to operate need not be a consideration in any HOA decision; they could limit you to a small UHF whip a few inches long on your gutter and say that have accommodated Amateur Radio. An HOA that previously existed only to conduct limited activities, such as maintaining roads, utilities and exterior landscaping, one that has never held any power to regulate Amateur Radio, would be granted the power to demand the removal of existing antennas and to demand that an Amateur seek its approval to install any Amateur antennas or supports. Imagine having moved into a neighborhood because the HOA had no regulatory power over Amateur Radio antennas, only to have Federal law now grant the HOA that power! The compromise bill expressly disconnects itself from PRB-1. Unfortunately, that means that none of the Ham-friendly court decisions interpreting PRB-1 would be binding on an HOA. It has been argued that the FCC, in writing the regulations required by HR-555, could eliminate some of the above risks. However, the FCC has opposed restricting the rights of HOAs for over thirty years, and I don't think it is prudent to count on the Commission to reverse itself and interpret the law in our favor. Neither can we count on CAI, having won the rights it demanded, to sit by and make no attempt to influence the post-enactment regulatory process in its favor. Wishful thinking to the contrary is hardly a sound basis on which to make our decisions. Because of the aforementioned shortcomings of HR-555 and the likely adverse consequences of its passage, I cannot support it any longer. There may be a better path than the one the League is now pursuing; I don't know if we can ever get there, but I certainly don't want us to make things worse for a significant number of Amateurs or expose them to being found in violation of Federal law and FCC regulations. Please consider these points when you are asked to write letters of support for HR-555 to your legislators. As an aside, I want to remind you that some licensees have been successful in selling the advantages of Amateur Radio-based disaster communication capability to their HOA boards. Offering benefits can be much easier and less costly than demanding one's rights. 73, Marty N6VI --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From mjcal77 at yahoo.com Sat Aug 5 21:03:17 2017 From: mjcal77 at yahoo.com (CL in NC) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 01:03:17 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> Boy this one will generate a lot of traffic. I wrote my reps, told them I didn't care how they voted, but asked them if they really thought the Feds needed to step into something that adults, knowing full well the rules and restrictions, signed their name and paid their fees to move into places like that, and now are whining because they can't do their hobby. Why would anyone move to a place where you have to ask permission to paint your own house, and be told the colors that are authorized? Charlie, W4MEC in NC From ranchorobbo at gmail.com Sat Aug 5 21:30:15 2017 From: ranchorobbo at gmail.com (Rob Atkinson) Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2017 20:30:15 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: >Why would anyone move to a place where you have to ask permission to paint your own house, and be told the colors that are authorized? > A few reasons: there are now (I'm told) some places where if you land a job and don't want a long drive to work you pretty much have to live in a HOA. HOAs are all over the place now apparently. Some folks move into one, THEN get interested in radio, not the other way around. There are marriages where the XYL makes all the do re mi and wears the pants and decides where they'll live. Some OM like HOAs; XYLs seem to love them. And not everyone is a property owner's rights libertarian like me. 73 Rob K5UJ From k4kyv at charter.net Sat Aug 5 23:36:12 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2017 22:36:12 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000701d30e65$268df680$73a9e380$@charter.net> > A few reasons: there are now (I'm told) some places where if you land a job > and don't want a long drive to work you pretty much have to live > in a HOA. HOAs are all over the place now apparently. They are pretty much the default nationwide with new developments. The no-antenna rule is included in the boilerplate nearly all real estate developers used to formulate their deed restrictions and that HOAs used to formulate their rules, not because someone specifically objected to outdoor radio antennas. But the would-be purchaser has no choice but to sign the contract that includes the restrictions, since in order to purchase the otherwise desirable piece of property, it's a take-it-or-leave-it deal. So much for life in the so-called land of the free. I like what you said, that any licensed ham who thinks antennas are an eyesore should tear up his ticket and find another hobby. Don k4kyv --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From ne1s at securespeed.us Sun Aug 6 08:28:55 2017 From: ne1s at securespeed.us (Larry Szendrei) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 08:28:55 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1da32289-6f8a-3c13-3bab-649d7974a887@securespeed.us> On 8/5/17 9:30 PM, Rob Atkinson wrote: > And not everyone is a property owner's rights libertarian like me. > ...and I think that's a damn shame. I'm with you, Rob, but I think individuals need to push back against the HOAs by voting with their wallets and being vocal about their reasons for not wishing to join one, as much as possible. 73, -Larry/NE1S From edwmullin at aol.com Sun Aug 6 10:06:23 2017 From: edwmullin at aol.com (Ed) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 10:06:23 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: <1da32289-6f8a-3c13-3bab-649d7974a887@securespeed.us> References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> <1da32289-6f8a-3c13-3bab-649d7974a887@securespeed.us> Message-ID: <49C7015E-7BC7-4AFF-B6BC-743D1149DBA0@aol.com> I have always wondered why so many people were willing to surrender control of their most valued possession. I also wonder what it takes to modify a deed or HOA. The HOA agreements are a form of contract, I've heard of people modifying those contracts at signing, and having the modified form stand in court, because the rep for the HOA did not read the agreement before signing. As for deeds, once you have paid the debts against the property, how hard is it to change a deed. I've heard tell of folks getting land patents, which are basically unrestricted deeds. Sadly it boils down to those few who have the resources for a protracted legal battle. You can be right as rain and still lose because you simply cant afford to fight for your rights. VR, Ed Mullin > On Aug 6, 2017, at 8:28 AM, Larry Szendrei wrote: > >> On 8/5/17 9:30 PM, Rob Atkinson wrote: >> And not everyone is a property owner's rights libertarian like me. > > ...and I think that's a damn shame. > > I'm with you, Rob, but I think individuals need to push back against the HOAs by voting with their wallets and being vocal about their reasons for not wishing to join one, as much as possible. > > 73, > -Larry/NE1S > > > ______________________________________________________________ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to edwmullin at aol.com From edwmullin at aol.com Sun Aug 6 10:37:37 2017 From: edwmullin at aol.com (Ed) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 10:37:37 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <7D41695D-3C56-44C3-933F-BB062A49D321@aol.com> Because when one gives up some of their rights, we all lose some. The erosion of our rights and liberties is an insidious, and very real, thing. VR, Ed Mullin > On Aug 5, 2017, at 9:03 PM, CL in NC via AMRadio wrote: > > Boy this one will generate a lot of traffic. I wrote my reps, told them I didn't care how they voted, but asked them if they really thought the Feds needed to step into something that adults, knowing full well the rules and restrictions, signed their name and paid their fees to move into places like that, and now are whining because they can't do their hobby. Why would anyone move to a place where you have to ask permission to paint your own house, and be told the colors that are authorized? > > Charlie, W4MEC in NC > ______________________________________________________________ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to edwmullin at aol.com From hbrnut at suddenlink.net Sun Aug 6 11:11:11 2017 From: hbrnut at suddenlink.net (WA5VGO) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 10:11:11 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2ad56b82-dfef-9c1d-45cb-6266709534f2@suddenlink.net> Why would anyone move to a place where you have to ask permission to paint your own house, and be told the colors that are authorized? It's simple-esthetics. I got tired of having neighbors parking their Kenworths and boats in the front yard or painting their homes hot pink. My HOA homes have also always maintained property value much better than the non-HOA. If I've got to choose between a hobby or my home and family, the hobby's going to come out last every time. > > From edwmullin at aol.com Sun Aug 6 11:27:42 2017 From: edwmullin at aol.com (Ed) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 11:27:42 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Advice on feedline wall penetrations Message-ID: <40CC82E2-2C74-43F6-B971-DA865C49357D@aol.com> Move the shack to a nice new room. The this means also providing some sort of feed line pass through. I will be using ladder line and A couple coax feeds. Needs to look nice fer the XYL else I wont get managements approval for the project. Just wondering what others have done in this area. VR, Ed Mullin From w4ron at carolina.rr.com Sun Aug 6 12:15:02 2017 From: w4ron at carolina.rr.com (Ron Lawrence W4RON) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 12:15:02 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20170806161503.WBEXC.127385.root@dnvrco-web08> When we bought our house I wasn't yet a ham, it'd be 3 years until I got my ticket, but I made sure we didn't buy a house in a deed restricted HOA neighborhood. I about drove our real estate agent crazy making her pull the restrictions and covenants on any property we were interested in. Any HOA put it out of consideration. Back in the mid 90s I was president of our local ham radio club and my phone number was listed in the as the contact for anyone wanting to know about ham radio. I typically got one or two phone calls a months from some ham that had just moved into a new neighborohood in our county and suddenly discovered they couldn't put up their antennas and wanted to know what they could do. I told them to move, you signed a contract when you bought the house and now you're stuck. There are lots of books out there on putting in stealth antennas, that's about your only choice. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Knee-deep in the cosmic overwhelm, I?m stricken by the ricochet wonder of it all: the plain everythingness of everything, in cahoots with the everythingness of everything else. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 73, Ron W4RON http://radioheaven.homestead.com https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B6ULchf6nR4xa1NWdENRU0tCNGc From k4kyv at charter.net Sun Aug 6 13:39:49 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 12:39:49 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: <20170806161503.WBEXC.127385.root@dnvrco-web08> References: <20170806161503.WBEXC.127385.root@dnvrco-web08> Message-ID: <000601d30edb$00983c80$01c8b580$@charter.net> > I told them to move, you signed a contract when you bought > the house and now you're stuck. There are lots of books out there on putting > in stealth antennas, that's about your only choice. And if that currently watered-down and toothless Parity Act passes in Congress, erecting stealth antennas on HOA-controlled property without notification and approval will be a violation of Part 97 rules. Don k4kyv --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From k4kyv at charter.net Sun Aug 6 13:59:10 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 12:59:10 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: <2ad56b82-dfef-9c1d-45cb-6266709534f2@suddenlink.net> References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> <2ad56b82-dfef-9c1d-45cb-6266709534f2@suddenlink.net> Message-ID: <000f01d30edd$b51db2a0$1f5917e0$@charter.net> > On Behalf Of WA5VGO > Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's > > Why would anyone move to a place where you have to ask permission to > paint your own house, and be told the colors that are authorized? > > It's simple-esthetics. I got tired of having neighbors parking their Kenworths > and boats in the front yard or painting their homes hot pink. > My HOA homes have also always maintained property value much better > than the non-HOA. If I've got to choose between a hobby or my home and > family, the hobby's going to come out last every time. The same tired old bogus argument. Outdoor antennas, particularly wire strung between trees and vertical masts in the back yard have absolutely nothing to do with boats, tractor trailers or old cars in the front yard or painting the house pink. The killer with HOAs is the mindlessly inclusive boilerplate regulations inserted by default in nearly every present-day real estate development contract. As Rob just pointed out, a ham who accepts the idea that antennas are an eyesore, should tear up his ticket and find another hobby. Don k4kyv --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From K4TQF at yahoo.com Sun Aug 6 14:06:17 2017 From: K4TQF at yahoo.com (Mike Durff) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 18:06:17 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's References: <147778851.630986.1502042777840.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <147778851.630986.1502042777840@mail.yahoo.com> How about living in a town of 2000 where the WHOLE TOWN is a designated historic district? Well, I lived in such a place for 10+ years and still own 3.5 acres and a shack there. How do I get around the hysterical guidelines? According to the HDC coordinator, I would need to erect an antenna that is "historically" or "period" correct. So, lets see... a couple of??400' tall Trylon towers with a 6 wire flattop should do nicely.? Durff, K4TQF Eureka Springs, Arkansas | | | | | | | | | | | Eureka Springs, Arkansas Eureka Springs Arkansas Nestled in the heart of the Ozark Mountains of Northwest Arkansas, offering relaxation, ... | | | | From hbrnut at suddenlink.net Sun Aug 6 14:17:48 2017 From: hbrnut at suddenlink.net (WA5VGO) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 13:17:48 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: <000f01d30edd$b51db2a0$1f5917e0$@charter.net> References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> <2ad56b82-dfef-9c1d-45cb-6266709534f2@suddenlink.net> <000f01d30edd$b51db2a0$1f5917e0$@charter.net> Message-ID: On Aug 6, 2017, at 12:59 PM, Donald Chester wrote: >> On Behalf Of WA5VGO >> Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's >> >> Why would anyone move to a place where you have to ask permission to >> paint your own house, and be told the colors that are authorized? >> >> It's simple-esthetics. I got tired of having neighbors parking their > Kenworths >> and boats in the front yard or painting their homes hot pink. >> My HOA homes have also always maintained property value much better >> than the non-HOA. If I've got to choose between a hobby or my home and >> family, the hobby's going to come out last every time. > > The same tired old bogus argument. > > Outdoor antennas, particularly wire strung between trees and vertical masts > in the back yard have absolutely nothing to do with boats, tractor trailers > or old cars in the front yard or painting the house pink. The killer with > HOAs is the mindlessly inclusive boilerplate regulations inserted by default > in nearly every present-day real estate development contract. > > As Rob just pointed out, a ham who accepts the idea that antennas are an > eyesore, should tear up his ticket and find another hobby. > > Don I'm not speaking in terms of antennas. I'm speaking to the whole concept of HOA's. You have to take or reject the entire package. Naturally, I believe modest antennas don't create a problem. All I'm saying is that for most people, the good outweighs the bad. I do believe it's a shame they're necessary, but there are always a couple of jerks that are hell-bent on destroying the property valves of everyone around them. It's a cross section of America. 10% of the people create 90% of the problems. Darrell > From w5jo at brightok.net Sun Aug 6 15:07:16 2017 From: w5jo at brightok.net (w5jo at brightok.net) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 14:07:16 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com><1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com><2ad56b82-dfef-9c1d-45cb-6266709534f2@suddenlink.net><000f01d30edd$b51db2a0$1f5917e0$@charter.net> Message-ID: <361D06FF35634C33A933C24B02836888@JimPC> I live in an area that was incorporated in the mid 70s which has CC&Rs. Fortunately they cover the bad stuff, too many animals, abandoned cars, temporary housing of any kind, goats, pigs, cows, horses, chickens and it is designated as residential property. Problem is some owners have sold direct to other people without a Real Estate Agent, so the Covenants do not get passed along. There is no Home Owner's Association as such, but an individual can sue any offending party. That has prevented a lot of problems with unsightly lots and acres. Not only that but the residents here purchase property for sale to keep the area neat. Now the good part! There are no restrictions against towers or antennas of any sort. I have up a 60 ft. self supporting tower with a 4 element beam and wire antennas for the lower bands. When I moved here I asked my closest neighbor if he minded the presence of my antenna. He works with the volunteer fire department and said, Hell No, that gives us communication possibilities should the need arise. In return, I put the antenna is an area that makes it less noticeable and decorate it each Christmas with flashing lights and a star on top. However, because of some problems in other areas, I have been involved with lawyers over a challenge. One thing is indisputable, all covenants must be enforced or all are void. To make matters worse, many HOAs pay association dues which goes into a bank account for enforcing the covenants. So if you have restrictions against antennas the only you can put up are dish antennas for TV. However if you can convince the association to give you a waver, you hit pay dirt. This happened in Lubbock, TX some years back and it resulted in new membership on the HOA board, but the guy still has his tower up. Jim W5JO -----Original Message---- I'm not speaking in terms of antennas. I'm speaking to the whole concept of HOA's. You have to take or reject the entire package. Naturally, I believe modest antennas don't create a problem. All I'm saying is that for most people, the good outweighs the bad. I do believe it's a shame they're necessary, but there are always a couple of jerks that are hell-bent on destroying the property valves of everyone around them. It's a cross section of America. 10% of the people create 90% of the problems. Darrell > From hbrnut at suddenlink.net Sun Aug 6 15:36:47 2017 From: hbrnut at suddenlink.net (WA5VGO) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 14:36:47 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: <361D06FF35634C33A933C24B02836888@JimPC> References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> <2ad56b82-dfef-9c1d-45cb-6266709534f2@suddenlink.net> <000f01d30edd$b51db2a0$1f5917e0$@charter.net> <361D06FF35634C33A933C24B02836888@JimPC> Message-ID: This all makes perfect sense. Too bad other developments don't follow this practice. I do believe some HOS's have gone too far and that many board members are small people with huge egos. I'm all for personal property freedom. However, it's the age old question-when does one person's freedom start infringing on someone else's? To me, when my neighbor's decisions begin to negatively affect my investment, they've crossed a line. I would expect them to view my actions the same way. By the way, Houston is the largest city in the world with no zoning. And I mean none whatsoever. Without something in place to protect property value you can imagine what would ensue. Darrell > On Aug 6, 2017, at 2:07 PM, wrote: > > I live in an area that was incorporated in the mid 70s which has CC&Rs. Fortunately they cover the bad stuff, too many animals, abandoned cars, temporary housing of any kind, goats, pigs, cows, horses, chickens and it is designated as residential property. Problem is some owners have sold direct to other people without a Real Estate Agent, so the Covenants do not get passed along. There is no Home Owner's Association as such, but an individual can sue any offending party. That has prevented a lot of problems with unsightly lots and acres. > > Not only that but the residents here purchase property for sale to keep the area neat. Now the good part! There are no restrictions against towers or antennas of any sort. I have up a 60 ft. self supporting tower with a 4 element beam and wire antennas for the lower bands. When I moved here I asked my closest neighbor if he minded the presence of my antenna. He works with the volunteer fire department and said, Hell No, that gives us communication possibilities should the need arise. In return, I put the antenna is an area that makes it less noticeable and decorate it each Christmas with flashing lights and a star on top. > > However, because of some problems in other areas, I have been involved with lawyers over a challenge. One thing is indisputable, all covenants must be enforced or all are void. To make matters worse, many HOAs pay association dues which goes into a bank account for enforcing the covenants. So if you have restrictions against antennas the only you can put up are dish antennas for TV. However if you can convince the association to give you a waver, you hit pay dirt. This happened in Lubbock, TX some years back and it resulted in new membership on the HOA board, but the guy still has his tower up. > > Jim > W5JO > > > -----Original Message---- > > I'm not speaking in terms of antennas. I'm speaking to the whole concept of HOA's. You have to take or reject the entire package. Naturally, I believe modest antennas don't create a problem. All I'm saying is that for most people, the good outweighs the bad. I do believe it's a shame they're necessary, but there are always a couple of jerks that are hell-bent on destroying the property valves of everyone around them. It's a cross section of America. 10% of the people create 90% of the problems. > > Darrell >> > > > ______________________________________________________________ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to hbrnut at suddenlink.net From W4AWM at aol.com Sun Aug 6 15:43:25 2017 From: W4AWM at aol.com (W4AWM at aol.com) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 15:43:25 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] ANTS AND HOAS Message-ID: <1f4e45.5cee54d3.46b8cb5d@aol.com> Quit filling my mailbox with your whining and join the ARRL in it's fight to gain passage of the reasonable antenna acts now before congress. Write or phone your Senators and Representatives. S1534 Passed the Senate HR 555 to be voted on and needs your support 73, John, W4AWM From w5jo at brightok.net Sun Aug 6 15:51:55 2017 From: w5jo at brightok.net (w5jo at brightok.net) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 14:51:55 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] ANTS AND HOAS In-Reply-To: <1f4e45.5cee54d3.46b8cb5d@aol.com> References: <1f4e45.5cee54d3.46b8cb5d@aol.com> Message-ID: <0BBA1C2B5CE34664A37973D40AB7848F@JimPC> John, Please use you delete key or subscribe to the digest form. That would solve the problem and allow the rest who want to comment the opportunity. Jim W5JO -----Original Message----- Quit filling my mailbox with your whining and join the ARRL in it's fight to gain passage of the reasonable antenna acts now before congress. Write or phone your Senators and Representatives. S1534 Passed the Senate HR 555 to be voted on and needs your support 73, John, W4AWM From k4kyv at charter.net Sun Aug 6 15:59:56 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 14:59:56 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> <2ad56b82-dfef-9c1d-45cb-6266709534f2@suddenlink.net> <000f01d30edd$b51db2a0$1f5917e0$@charter.net> Message-ID: <000801d30eee$93f022f0$bbd068d0$@charter.net> > I'm not speaking in terms of antennas. I'm speaking to the whole concept of > HOA's. You have to take or reject the entire package. Naturally, I believe > modest antennas don't create a problem. All I'm saying is that for most > people, the good outweighs the bad. I do believe it's a shame they're > necessary, but there are always a couple of jerks that are hell-bent on > destroying the property valves of everyone around them. It's a cross section > of America. 10% of the people create 90% of the problems. > > Darrell But those "entire packages" don't have to be standard one size fits all, by default, mindlessly copied from some out-of-state boilerplate document, with no prior input from potential buyers. I'd say 95% of the residents in those no-antenna restricted communities couldn't have cared less if someone had a non-obtrusive tower or antenna behind his house, even if visible from the street, and that VERY few people, even those with zero interest in radio, would have consciously declined to buy a house in a neighbourhood because the people down the street had a visible antenna on their property. Don k4kyv --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From k4kyv at charter.net Sun Aug 6 16:09:20 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 15:09:20 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] ANTS AND HOAS In-Reply-To: <1f4e45.5cee54d3.46b8cb5d@aol.com> References: <1f4e45.5cee54d3.46b8cb5d@aol.com> Message-ID: <000a01d30eef$e432bf60$ac983e20$@charter.net> > Quit filling my mailbox with your whining and join the ARRL in it's fight to gain > passage of the reasonable antenna acts now before congress. Write or > phone your Senators and Representatives. > S1534 Passed the Senate > HR 555 to be voted on and needs your support > > 73, > > John, W4AWM Here's a good reason why some hams who would want the freedom to install "reasonable antennas" on their property might not want this legislation in its present watered-down form. (From a previous post): On Wednesday, August 2, 2017 5:52 PM, Marty Woll wrote: Now that I am a former ARRL Vice Director, I am free to speak my mind on this matter. As a long-time proponent of antenna rights, it is with great disappointment that I say I do not favor passage of HR-555. I should add up front, by way of disclaimer, that I am not an attorney. I was a big supporter of the original Amateur Radio Parity Act - the PRB-1 version. The ability to put up outdoor antennas and the structures necessary to support them on your property is crucial to being an active Ham for many licensees. Since 2010 I have visited the offices of numerous elected officials, sent over a thousand e-mail messages, spent entire convention weekends generating letters from Hams to their elected representatives and spoken at countless club meetings to drum up support for this legislation. It's fair to say that I invested a major chunk of my time in support of the original Parity Act, and I certainly respect ARRL leadership for its persistence in seeking relief for all impacted Amateurs, whether League members or not. However, in February of 2016 the language that mirrored PRB-1 was removed from HR-1301 (now HR-555), and this is a critique of the result, not of the intent or effort. Last year, ARRL found itself at odds with one senator over the bill and was required to negotiate compromise language with CAI, a national trade association of homeowner associations (HOAs) and similar groups. While I had some major misgivings at the time, I did not object to the compromise language because I believed it would help at least those Amateurs who live in homes with developer-imposed deed restrictions not within the purview of an active HOA. Since that time, however, some high-profile, competent and very knowledgeable attorneys (all of them Hams but none associated with the ARRL Board) have evaluated the compromise language and found that it may do more harm than good. They have pointed out some serious shortcomings in HR-555 that significantly restrict how many Hams may benefit from its passage and that, if uncorrected, could actually diminish the rights of some Amateurs and grant the right to regulate Amateur antennas to HOAs that do not now have that right. What follows is an abbreviated description of the issues surrounding HR-555, the current version of the Parity Act. For those who want to dig deeper into the matter, I have a version I can e-mail you separately that include attachments containing (1) the original bill language, (2) the compromise language in the current bill, and (3) an analysis prepared by former FCC attorney and active Amateur Radio operator Jim Talens N3JT for the Potomac Valley Radio Club. Many of the points in Jim's critique were also made by Fred Hopengarten K1VR (author of Antenna Zoning for the Radio Amateur) at his presentation to the Legal Forum at the May 2017 Dayton Hamvention. Suffice it to say that the expert Ham-attorneys are NOT all lining up in support of HR-555 in its current form. The original bill pretty much paralleled PRB-1, the Federal Preemption Statute. It required the FCC to revise its regulations to prohibit private deed restrictions that preclude or fail to reasonably accommodate Amateur Radio communications or that do not constitute the minimum practicable restriction on such communications to accomplish the legitimate purpose of the private entity seeking to enforce such restriction. On the other hand, the compromise bill that CAI insisted on does the following: 1) It grants HOAs the right to use aesthetics as a basis for antenna decisions, even to those associations whose rules do not now have any provisions concerning antennas. This grant of power to HOAs is unprecedented in Federal law, and it adds a right - as a matter of Federal law - for HOA's that has never been previously approved in Federal law. That right cannot be undone by state law. 2) It requires a deed-restricted Amateur to notify and seek prior permission from the HOA before installing any outdoor antenna, with no grandfathering for those already installed. 3) It does not establish a time frame within which the HOA must render a decision; an HOA can stall indefinitely and do so without adverse consequence. 4) It does not grant or guarantee to an Amateur the right to operate on the band(s) of his or her choice. 5) It permits but does not require the HOA to establish written rules regarding antenna size, type and location. 6) It does not establish or require an HOA administrative process for redress if an HOA denies a Ham's requested antenna. The decision of the HOA is final. Under HR-555, if passed, Hams who have existing "stealth" antennas, even with the concurrence of their immediate neighbors, would now be in violation of Federal law and FCC regulations. HOAs will be legally able to write their own rules with no objective criteria and no standards, and they will have the unrestricted power of Federal law to back them up. The band(s) on which the Amateur wishes to operate need not be a consideration in any HOA decision; they could limit you to a small UHF whip a few inches long on your gutter and say that have accommodated Amateur Radio. An HOA that previously existed only to conduct limited activities, such as maintaining roads, utilities and exterior landscaping, one that has never held any power to regulate Amateur Radio, would be granted the power to demand the removal of existing antennas and to demand that an Amateur seek its approval to install any Amateur antennas or supports. Imagine having moved into a neighborhood because the HOA had no regulatory power over Amateur Radio antennas, only to have Federal law now grant the HOA that power! The compromise bill expressly disconnects itself from PRB-1. Unfortunately, that means that none of the Ham-friendly court decisions interpreting PRB-1 would be binding on an HOA. It has been argued that the FCC, in writing the regulations required by HR-555, could eliminate some of the above risks. However, the FCC has opposed restricting the rights of HOAs for over thirty years, and I don't think it is prudent to count on the Commission to reverse itself and interpret the law in our favor. Neither can we count on CAI, having won the rights it demanded, to sit by and make no attempt to influence the post-enactment regulatory process in its favor. Wishful thinking to the contrary is hardly a sound basis on which to make our decisions. Because of the aforementioned shortcomings of HR-555 and the likely adverse consequences of its passage, I cannot support it any longer. There may be a better path than the one the League is now pursuing; I don't know if we can ever get there, but I certainly don't want us to make things worse for a significant number of Amateurs or expose them to being found in violation of Federal law and FCC regulations. Please consider these points when you are asked to write letters of support for HR-555 to your legislators. As an aside, I want to remind you that some licensees have been successful in selling the advantages of Amateur Radio-based disaster communication capability to their HOA boards. Offering benefits can be much easier and less costly than demanding one's rights. 73, Marty N6VI --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From hbrnut at suddenlink.net Sun Aug 6 16:09:21 2017 From: hbrnut at suddenlink.net (WA5VGO) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 15:09:21 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] ANTS AND HOAS In-Reply-To: <1f4e45.5cee54d3.46b8cb5d@aol.com> References: <1f4e45.5cee54d3.46b8cb5d@aol.com> Message-ID: On 8/6/2017 2:43 PM, W4AWM via AMRadio wrote: > Quit filling my mailbox with your whining and join the ARRL in it's fight > to gain passage of the reasonable antenna acts now before congress. Write or > phone your Senators and Representatives. > S1534 Passed the Senate > HR 555 to be voted on and needs your support > > 73, > > John, W4AWM > John, This forum is just like an HOA. No one is forced to sign an HOA and no one is forcing you to belong to this forum. Darrell > From ranchorobbo at gmail.com Sun Aug 6 18:40:37 2017 From: ranchorobbo at gmail.com (Rob Atkinson) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 17:40:37 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: <2ad56b82-dfef-9c1d-45cb-6266709534f2@suddenlink.net> References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> <2ad56b82-dfef-9c1d-45cb-6266709534f2@suddenlink.net> Message-ID: > It's simple-esthetics. I got tired of having neighbors parking their > Kenworths and boats in the front yard or painting their homes hot pink. My > HOA homes have also always maintained property value much better than the > non-HOA. If I've got to choose between a hobby or my home and family, the > hobby's going to come out last every time. > My neighbor personal rules are simple: Anything is okay except: 1. Violations of law 2. actions that negatively affect my home life 3. actions that put my property or health at risk Examples: 1: You can't operate a meth lab or run a whore house. 2. You can blast party music at 2 p.m. but not at 11 p.m. 3. You can have a chem. lab next door but you can't enrich uranium; you can blow off mowing your lawn but not if it gets so long you have rats and rattlesnakes; you can park junkers in the drive way and work on them but when the yard gets full and rats move in I call County Health Dept., you can have a fire in a fireplace inside but the victory bonfire that can catch a tree on fire and next my house, is no-go. I'm easy to get along with--you can paint your house any color you want. Most of these "aesthetic" concerns (including antennas) have never been proven to lower property values. Life is a two way street: I am easy and I expect my neighbors to be easy also. 73 Rob K5UJ From knjhanlon at msn.com Sun Aug 6 20:10:10 2017 From: knjhanlon at msn.com (JAMES HANLON) Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2017 00:10:10 +0000 Subject: [AMRadio] Advice on feedline wall penetrations In-Reply-To: <40CC82E2-2C74-43F6-B971-DA865C49357D@aol.com> References: <40CC82E2-2C74-43F6-B971-DA865C49357D@aol.com> Message-ID: Ed, I installed a dryer vent and ran my ladder line through it, using some fiber glass packing to achieve adequate spacing. Jim, W8KGI ________________________________ From: Ed Sent: Sunday, August 6, 2017 9:27 AM To: Subject: [AMRadio] Advice on feedline wall penetrations Move the shack to a nice new room. The this means also providing some sort of feed line pass through. I will be using ladder line and A couple coax feeds. Needs to look nice fer the XYL else I wont get managements approval for the project. Just wondering what others have done in this area. VR, Ed Mullin From donroden at hiwaay.net Sun Aug 6 20:24:42 2017 From: donroden at hiwaay.net (donroden at hiwaay.net) Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2017 19:24:42 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> <2ad56b82-dfef-9c1d-45cb-6266709534f2@suddenlink.net> Message-ID: <20170806192442.Horde.ATtzma2ANe-Qm4XNY2giD3W@webmail.hiwaay.net> Quoting Rob Atkinson : > Examples: > 1: You can't operate a meth lab or run a whore house. Thumbs up on #1, but I have always wanted to run a whorehouse. :-) Don W4NPL DonR From k4kyv at charter.net Sun Aug 6 22:36:25 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 21:36:25 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: <20170806192442.Horde.ATtzma2ANe-Qm4XNY2giD3W@webmail.hiwaay.net> References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> <2ad56b82-dfef-9c1d-45cb-6266709534f2@suddenlink.net> <20170806192442.Horde.ATtzma2ANe-Qm4XNY2giD3W@webmail.hiwaay.net> Message-ID: <002601d30f25$f760d000$e6227000$@charter.net> > Quoting Rob Atkinson : > > > Examples: > > 1: You can't operate a meth lab or run a whore house. > > > Thumbs up on #1, but I have always wanted to run a whorehouse. :-) Don > W4NPL Well, if you want to grow some weed for personal use that's OK too, but make damned sure your grow lights don't raise my noise floor. Don k4kyv --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From jayw5jay at gmail.com Sun Aug 6 23:03:29 2017 From: jayw5jay at gmail.com (Jay Bromley) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 22:03:29 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: <1da32289-6f8a-3c13-3bab-649d7974a887@securespeed.us> References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> <1da32289-6f8a-3c13-3bab-649d7974a887@securespeed.us> Message-ID: Hi Larry and all, The problem is, well at least in this part of the world, finding a place that doesn't have an HOA. That includes being out in the country! My wife found a new job some 1 hour away from our old home and ended up staying up near the new job during the week. BTW, this was a requirement as she is a supervisor for a hospital she works at. No matter rain, snow or shine, she has to be there! I have mentioned this to several hams every time this subject comes up, but it doesn't seem to soak in unless you have moved recently. It took us five years to find a place up in Northwest Arkansas near her work. Well we cut the drive time down for her to just under 20 minutes and everything else is within that distance or less. It took us 5 years of looking hard to find this place and now I am surrounded by power lines with noise. I think I can get a handle on the noise. I was getting desperate and even the realtor noticed it. When we found this place I asked my wife if she liked the kitchen and she said yes, I looked over at the realtor and said OK, let's do it. While I was even with my signing the papers there was another person out in the driveway for a second look that probably would have bought this house. I had about a half a dozen stories like this. I know it is hard to believe for some hams that are lucky enough to vote with their wallet or have many years ago. However what we have for decades called PRB-1, wasn't working unless you wanted to go it alone legally and even that is not a sure thing. I was once in a town, not in an HOA, and know all too well about what it cost legally to go it alone as some neighbors complained about my tower that wasn't regulated by the city. Still they considered it a broadcast structure and they didn't know the difference between that and ham radio! Now the counties are getting into the mix regulating towers they consider an eye sore, etc. I have just under 3 acres here and the limit for Washington county here is 80 feet So much for a full size 160m vertical. Funny we can't dig a well, but we can have livestock, etc. Regulations are creeping up on us all and now of the ham installations are rarely permanent as were are not on this earth, hi. No wonder the hobby is dwindling down, who wants to fight all this, when you have enough to do with building a station and then trying to get all the noise sources figured out. BTW, my youngest daughter just got a job in Virginia and they are having hard time finding a place. They found one place they like only to learn they can have pets. They have two small dogs. She only has a few weeks to figure something out before starting the new job that her family can afford. They been looking hard for a month and the other problem is her husband has a job about an hour away at a local university. Even though this is not related to ham radio in any way I thought it was interesting to see in a different part of the country they are having the same issues as here in Arkansas. One thing that some posters here don't consider here, how in the world is a new teenager supposed to vote with his wallet if he/she is interested in the hobby? They are usually years away from heading to college and we wonder why we don't have more young folks into the hobby. I started when I was 12 years old and back then we routinely put up 70 foot towers right in town and no one cared. They were always gone in a few years, hams going to college or getting married, etc. I am not an attorney and don't know what is right on this issue. I did do the ARRL link to my senators and even got back a response. We really are not relevant these days in emergency, but they always seem to say something about this in their replies. Oh well just my .5 cents on the subject. YMMV. :-) 73 de w5jay/jay.. On Sun, Aug 6, 2017 at 7:28 AM, Larry Szendrei wrote: > On 8/5/17 9:30 PM, Rob Atkinson wrote: > >> And not everyone is a property owner's rights libertarian like me. >> >> > ...and I think that's a damn shame. > > I'm with you, Rob, but I think individuals need to push back against the > HOAs by voting with their wallets and being vocal about their reasons for > not wishing to join one, as much as possible. > > 73, > -Larry/NE1S > > > ______________________________________________________________ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to jayw5jay at gmail.com > From ranchorobbo at gmail.com Tue Aug 8 05:55:54 2017 From: ranchorobbo at gmail.com (Rob Atkinson) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2017 04:55:54 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Ants and HOA's In-Reply-To: <20170806192442.Horde.ATtzma2ANe-Qm4XNY2giD3W@webmail.hiwaay.net> References: <1625263006.497278.1501981397224.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1625263006.497278.1501981397224@mail.yahoo.com> <2ad56b82-dfef-9c1d-45cb-6266709534f2@suddenlink.net> <20170806192442.Horde.ATtzma2ANe-Qm4XNY2giD3W@webmail.hiwaay.net> Message-ID: The ARRL has published a "FAQ" on the "parity act." It is a PDF file so I have not bothered to read it because I don't want to take the time and trouble to download a file and open it. but for the record it is there. I don't know if it addresses the statements made by that ex-vice director in 6 land or not. I just thought I'd mention it to be fair. Usually FA Q and As are on html web pages so they are easy to read. ARRL does a pdf file and buries it. http://www.arrl.org/news/arrl-posts-amateur-radio-parity-act-faqs 73 Rob K5UJ From mjcal77 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 8 08:55:52 2017 From: mjcal77 at yahoo.com (CL in NC) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2017 12:55:52 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [AMRadio] Halli knob(s) References: <2017274377.2106512.1502196952899.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2017274377.2106512.1502196952899@mail.yahoo.com> Anybody have a junker Hallicrafters SX110 or similar that uses the same main tune and bandspread knobs as an SX110 that they could part with? Wonder why they all seem to have the edges broken off in similar ways, and not just a chip but a whole chunk? While both would be nice, one would be a big improvement over the one I have. Thanks Charlie, W4MEC in NC From w5jo at brightok.net Tue Aug 8 12:43:46 2017 From: w5jo at brightok.net (w5jo at brightok.net) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2017 11:43:46 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Amateur radio parity act Message-ID: Not too long back there was discussion of the Amateur Radio Parity Act and its meaning. Today I received a message from the ARRL about the subject and it provided a link to their stance plus a link to the bill as written and introduced. Here is a link to the bill on the congressional web site and, if you are interested, read it. It did clear up a lot of speculation on my part but I had to read it two times to really understand. That is required for me to process lawyerese. https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/house-bill/555/text?q=%7B%22search%22%3A%5B%22hr+555%22%5D%7D&r=1 Jim W5JO From k4kyv at charter.net Tue Aug 8 19:27:30 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2017 18:27:30 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Amateur radio parity act In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001601d3109d$e77f35e0$b67da1a0$@charter.net> > Not too long back there was discussion of the Amateur Radio Parity Act and > its meaning. Today I received a message from the ARRL about the subject > and it provided a link to their stance plus a link to the bill as written and > introduced. > > Here is a link to the bill on the congressional web site and, if you are > interested, read it. It did clear up a lot of speculation on my part but I had to > read it two times to really understand. That is required for me to process > lawyerese. They explained and clarified some points, but failed to satisfactorily address all of the issues brought up by Marty, N6VI: On Wednesday, August 2, 2017 5:52 PM, Marty Woll wrote: Now that I am a former ARRL Vice Director, I am free to speak my mind on this matter. As a long-time proponent of antenna rights, it is with great disappointment that I say I do not favor passage of HR-555. I should add up front, by way of disclaimer, that I am not an attorney. I was a big supporter of the original Amateur Radio Parity Act - the PRB-1 version. The ability to put up outdoor antennas and the structures necessary to support them on your property is crucial to being an active Ham for many licensees. Since 2010 I have visited the offices of numerous elected officials, sent over a thousand e-mail messages, spent entire convention weekends generating letters from Hams to their elected representatives and spoken at countless club meetings to drum up support for this legislation. It's fair to say that I invested a major chunk of my time in support of the original Parity Act, and I certainly respect ARRL leadership for its persistence in seeking relief for all impacted Amateurs, whether League members or not. However, in February of 2016 the language that mirrored PRB-1 was removed from HR-1301 (now HR-555), and this is a critique of the result, not of the intent or effort. Last year, ARRL found itself at odds with one senator over the bill and was required to negotiate compromise language with CAI, a national trade association of homeowner associations (HOAs) and similar groups. While I had some major misgivings at the time, I did not object to the compromise language because I believed it would help at least those Amateurs who live in homes with developer-imposed deed restrictions not within the purview of an active HOA. Since that time, however, some high-profile, competent and very knowledgeable attorneys (all of them Hams but none associated with the ARRL Board) have evaluated the compromise language and found that it may do more harm than good. They have pointed out some serious shortcomings in HR-555 that significantly restrict how many Hams may benefit from its passage and that, if uncorrected, could actually diminish the rights of some Amateurs and grant the right to regulate Amateur antennas to HOAs that do not now have that right. What follows is an abbreviated description of the issues surrounding HR-555, the current version of the Parity Act. For those who want to dig deeper into the matter, I have a version I can e-mail you separately that include attachments containing (1) the original bill language, (2) the compromise language in the current bill, and (3) an analysis prepared by former FCC attorney and active Amateur Radio operator Jim Talens N3JT for the Potomac Valley Radio Club. Many of the points in Jim's critique were also made by Fred Hopengarten K1VR (author of Antenna Zoning for the Radio Amateur) at his presentation to the Legal Forum at the May 2017 Dayton Hamvention. Suffice it to say that the expert Ham-attorneys are NOT all lining up in support of HR-555 in its current form. The original bill pretty much paralleled PRB-1, the Federal Preemption Statute. It required the FCC to revise its regulations to prohibit private deed restrictions that preclude or fail to reasonably accommodate Amateur Radio communications or that do not constitute the minimum practicable restriction on such communications to accomplish the legitimate purpose of the private entity seeking to enforce such restriction. On the other hand, the compromise bill that CAI insisted on does the following: 1) It grants HOAs the right to use aesthetics as a basis for antenna decisions, even to those associations whose rules do not now have any provisions concerning antennas. This grant of power to HOAs is unprecedented in Federal law, and it adds a right - as a matter of Federal law - for HOA's that has never been previously approved in Federal law. That right cannot be undone by state law. 2) It requires a deed-restricted Amateur to notify and seek prior permission from the HOA before installing any outdoor antenna, with no grandfathering for those already installed. 3) It does not establish a time frame within which the HOA must render a decision; an HOA can stall indefinitely and do so without adverse consequence. 4) It does not grant or guarantee to an Amateur the right to operate on the band(s) of his or her choice. 5) It permits but does not require the HOA to establish written rules regarding antenna size, type and location. 6) It does not establish or require an HOA administrative process for redress if an HOA denies a Ham's requested antenna. The decision of the HOA is final. Under HR-555, if passed, Hams who have existing "stealth" antennas, even with the concurrence of their immediate neighbors, would now be in violation of Federal law and FCC regulations. HOAs will be legally able to write their own rules with no objective criteria and no standards, and they will have the unrestricted power of Federal law to back them up. The band(s) on which the Amateur wishes to operate need not be a consideration in any HOA decision; they could limit you to a small UHF whip a few inches long on your gutter and say that have accommodated Amateur Radio. An HOA that previously existed only to conduct limited activities, such as maintaining roads, utilities and exterior landscaping, one that has never held any power to regulate Amateur Radio, would be granted the power to demand the removal of existing antennas and to demand that an Amateur seek its approval to install any Amateur antennas or supports. Imagine having moved into a neighborhood because the HOA had no regulatory power over Amateur Radio antennas, only to have Federal law now grant the HOA that power! The compromise bill expressly disconnects itself from PRB-1. Unfortunately, that means that none of the Ham-friendly court decisions interpreting PRB-1 would be binding on an HOA. It has been argued that the FCC, in writing the regulations required by HR-555, could eliminate some of the above risks. However, the FCC has opposed restricting the rights of HOAs for over thirty years, and I don't think it is prudent to count on the Commission to reverse itself and interpret the law in our favor. Neither can we count on CAI, having won the rights it demanded, to sit by and make no attempt to influence the post-enactment regulatory process in its favor. Wishful thinking to the contrary is hardly a sound basis on which to make our decisions. Because of the aforementioned shortcomings of HR-555 and the likely adverse consequences of its passage, I cannot support it any longer. There may be a better path than the one the League is now pursuing; I don't know if we can ever get there, but I certainly don't want us to make things worse for a significant number of Amateurs or expose them to being found in violation of Federal law and FCC regulations. Please consider these points when you are asked to write letters of support for HR-555 to your legislators. As an aside, I want to remind you that some licensees have been successful in selling the advantages of Amateur Radio-based disaster communication capability to their HOA boards. Offering benefits can be much easier and less costly than demanding one's rights. 73, Marty N6VI --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From k9fh at arrl.net Wed Aug 9 20:55:45 2017 From: k9fh at arrl.net (K9FH) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2017 19:55:45 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Amateur radio parity act In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Here is a link to a pdf of one more opinion on the subject Just Say No to H.R. 555/S.1534 http://www.kkn.net/~n6tv/Just_Say_No_to_S.1534_v4.pdf -- From mjcal77 at yahoo.com Wed Aug 9 21:09:22 2017 From: mjcal77 at yahoo.com (CL in NC) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 01:09:22 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [AMRadio] ARRL stance References: <20007071.984913.1502327362078.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20007071.984913.1502327362078@mail.yahoo.com> "...from the ARRL about the subject and it provided a link to their stance..." I tried to get a similar reply from the ARRL on their stance concerning the new VLF band and it's ridiculous power and antenna regulations. I wanted to know exactly what the comment was from the ARRL concerning the proposed rule making All I got was a weasel worded reply and go look it up at the FCC, along with the new found knowledge that the ARRL's comments carry the same weight as each individual commentor, and is not representative of their membership or the ham community as a whole. But their reply pales in comparison to the answer I got from the FCC when I asked about the process involved in coming up with those same ridiculous antenna and power restrictions. To simplify their reasoning and translate it all into Southerm, the FCC pulled all that out of their a**. Charlie W4MEC in NC From manualman at juno.com Thu Aug 10 13:24:29 2017 From: manualman at juno.com (manualman at juno.com) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 13:24:29 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] ARRL stance Message-ID: Amateurs will be considered secondary users on the new bands so restrictions are necessary and important. Primary user, I believe, will be the PLC. Pete, wa2cwa On Thu, 10 Aug 2017 01:09:22 +0000 (UTC) CL in NC via AMRadio writes: > "...from the ARRL about the subject and it provided a link to their > stance..." > > I tried to get a similar reply from the ARRL on their stance > concerning the new VLF band and it's ridiculous power and antenna > regulations. I wanted to know exactly what the comment was from the > ARRL concerning the proposed rule making All I got was a weasel > worded reply and go look it up at the FCC, along with the new found > knowledge that the ARRL's comments carry the same weight as each > individual commentor, and is not representative of their membership > or the ham community as a whole. But their reply pales in > comparison to the answer I got from the FCC when I asked about the > process involved in coming up with those same ridiculous antenna and > power restrictions. To simplify their reasoning and translate it > all into Southerm, the FCC pulled all that out of their a**. > > Charlie W4MEC in NC From k4kyv at charter.net Fri Aug 11 00:43:52 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 23:43:52 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] ARRL stance In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001001d3125c$6e824a40$4b86dec0$@charter.net> > On Behalf Of manualman at juno.com > Sent: Thursday, 10 August, 2017 12:24 > Amateurs will be considered secondary users on the new bands so > restrictions are necessary and important. Primary user, I believe, will be the > PLC. > > Pete, wa2cwa PLC is not a primary user. They fall under unlicensed Part 15, the same as garage door openers, home wi-fi routers, cordless telephones, phono oscillators, etc., and have no legal status. The FCC is stretching the Communications Act to limit licensed use of that part of the spectrum in order to protect that obsolete technology. Don k4kyv --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From archernf at earthlink.net Fri Aug 11 09:32:58 2017 From: archernf at earthlink.net (Neil Foster) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 09:32:58 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Need an HRO "E" coil Message-ID: <598DB20A.7090301@earthlink.net> Still trying....I hope someone can help Hello, I am helping a friend look for an "E" coil for a National 50/60. However I understand from the National HRO gurus that an earlier one will fit with shimming. I am not a National guy but a Hammarlund one. Any assistance is appreciated. Thanks Neil N4FN -- From jcandela at prodigy.net Fri Aug 11 12:30:37 2017 From: jcandela at prodigy.net (Jim Candela) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 11:30:37 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] HVAC RFI Question In-Reply-To: References: <43902980.1806385.1501363604516.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <43902980.1806385.1501363604516@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Update, The new system is mostly in, but duct work continues. Good news and bad news. The good news is that overnight the humidity dropped to 50%, and the "comfort feel" was really good. The new thermostat has a setting for humidity, and it will be set to 55%. There will be some level of ventilation ongoing to maintain that, so the temp and humidity should not be going up and down like it would with a conventional system which has two modes, ON, and OFF. The bad news is RFI, but not sure yet. The AC system is at one end of the home, and the Ham antenna is at the other end. The house is 1 level Ranch style, so it is a good distance between the AC and the Ham antenna. I have a little Sony portable in the master bathroom "reading room" (not far from AC), and I can say that some of the local BS stations are blocked (1370AM), as is 80m, 40m..Not good. Looks like I have some work to do. Sigh... Jim Wd5JKO On 7/29/2017 6:02 PM, Alan Victor wrote: > Sure Jim. > > I doubt seriously that you will find a statement on a microprocessor > based HVAC system that it will tolerate 2 kW of RF and the associated > RF voltage swings that may occur across 3.6 V logic! Get you bag of > magic tricks out if you see this happen. On the other hand, if you > plan the antenna system and feed line properly you may never see an > issue. Bottom line from my experience, try to get the antenna system > as far away from the home as possible. Makes all the difference in the > world especially on the receive side with the IoT in the homes today! > Alan > > On Sat, Jul 29, 2017 at 2:26 PM, Jim Candela > wrote: > > > > My old 2001 vintage American Standard AC system is conking out. I > am looking for a replacement, and this post is regarding HVAC > induced RFI into the ham bands. In order to get the SEER rating to > 20 or above, then both the AC air ventilator & outside compressor > must be computerized, have variable speed motors, and even have a > CAT-5 cable between the units. > > Those issues mentioned are all a red flag when it comes to RFI. > One quote I got was to use Lennox, XC20 Condenser, and SL280 > furnace and air handler, cost $10125. A more traditional system > without the bells and whistles is about $6180. This does not > include the duct rework that in my case has been haphazardly > redone by the prior owner of the house. > I wonder what experience the group might have regarding the > various modern day HVAC systems, and HAM radio RFI. Go a step > further, and I could see situations where a keyed up ham station > might result in RF getting into the HVAC control system and > creating a system that is susceptible to RF. > JimWd5JKO > ______________________________________________________________ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ > > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > > Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net > with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to amvictor at ncsu.edu > > From ranchorobbo at gmail.com Mon Aug 14 06:11:09 2017 From: ranchorobbo at gmail.com (Rob Atkinson) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2017 05:11:09 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Amateur radio parity act In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: saw this on another email list: http://www.cwops.org/newsletter/2017/06scopy17jun.pdf It's a pdf newsletter. You have to scroll down to the "guest editorial" by N3JT. He is also a lawyer and thinks the current bill is a bad idea. Rob K5UJ On Wed, Aug 9, 2017 at 7:55 PM, K9FH wrote: > Here is a link to a pdf of one more opinion on the subject > > Just Say No to H.R. 555/S.1534 > http://www.kkn.net/~n6tv/Just_Say_No_to_S.1534_v4.pdf > > From W2xj at w2xj.net Mon Aug 14 06:47:31 2017 From: W2xj at w2xj.net (W2xj) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2017 06:47:31 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Amateur radio parity act In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6EF122E8-C8EA-480A-9F46-37E47EC10DB1@w2xj.net> I think this requires serious attention. Sent from my iPad > On Aug 14, 2017, at 6:11 AM, Rob Atkinson wrote: > > saw this on another email list: > > http://www.cwops.org/newsletter/2017/06scopy17jun.pdf > > It's a pdf newsletter. You have to scroll down to the "guest > editorial" by N3JT. He is also a lawyer and thinks the current bill > is a bad idea. > > Rob > K5UJ > >> On Wed, Aug 9, 2017 at 7:55 PM, K9FH wrote: >> Here is a link to a pdf of one more opinion on the subject >> >> Just Say No to H.R. 555/S.1534 >> http://www.kkn.net/~n6tv/Just_Say_No_to_S.1534_v4.pdf >> >> > ______________________________________________________________ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to w2xj at w2xj.net > From k4kyv at charter.net Mon Aug 14 12:03:32 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2017 11:03:32 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Amateur radio parity act In-Reply-To: <6EF122E8-C8EA-480A-9F46-37E47EC10DB1@w2xj.net> References: <6EF122E8-C8EA-480A-9F46-37E47EC10DB1@w2xj.net> Message-ID: <000201d31516$e0ab41a0$a201c4e0$@charter.net> > On Behalf Of W2xj > I think this requires serious attention. Something that should resonate with some members of congress is the currently trendy buzzword "government over-reach", here getting the feds involved with the enforcement of "neighborhood associations" rules. This whole thing should be thrown out and re-written along the lines of the pre-watered down version that paralleled PRB-1. Don k4kyv --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From knjhanlon at msn.com Mon Aug 14 12:23:09 2017 From: knjhanlon at msn.com (JAMES HANLON) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2017 16:23:09 +0000 Subject: [AMRadio] Need an HRO "E" coil In-Reply-To: <598DB20A.7090301@earthlink.net> References: <598DB20A.7090301@earthlink.net> Message-ID: Neil, Yes, an E coil from any HRO will work. All HROs are single conversion on this range, so a coil from any of them will work in any other, with certain precautions ... The coils for the HRO-5 and earlier receivers have two handles, one on each side, that will not fit under the "crowbars" used to put coils in and out in the HRO-7, 50, 50T1 and 60 receivers. To use one of these earlier coils you will have to cut off the handles to the point where they protrude the same length as the studs found on the later coils. The coils for the HRO-7 and earlier receivers have the actual coil assemblies mounted higher in the coil shield cans than the coils for the HRO-50 and later. To use them in a later receiver, you should remove the coil assemblies from their cans and put a washer (spacer) in between the top of the coil assembly and the inside surface of the coil shield can in the three places where the assemblies are held to the cans by screws. This lowers the assemblies so that they don't damage the mating buss bars in the receiver. I've used an AC coil from an HRO-7 in my HRO-50 ever since about 1952, and I recently equipped a hamfest find HRO-50R1 with a full set of A, B, C, and D coils from an HRO Senior this way. The earlier coils align just as they should and work well. Jim Hanlon, W8KGI ________________________________ From: Neil Foster Sent: Friday, August 11, 2017 7:32 AM To: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net Subject: [AMRadio] Need an HRO "E" coil Still trying....I hope someone can help Hello, I am helping a friend look for an "E" coil for a National 50/60. However I understand from the National HRO gurus that an earlier one will fit with shimming. I am not a National guy but a Hammarlund one. Any assistance is appreciated. Thanks Neil N4FN -- From edwmullin at aol.com Wed Aug 16 20:27:29 2017 From: edwmullin at aol.com (Ed) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2017 20:27:29 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] QRN loud Message-ID: <542720F8-6960-4B95-8C6D-4A0966C600ED@aol.com> Ive got a new noise source, a pulsing signal that sounds like someone sending an endless string of dashed, with lots of hash. Very string on 80, and goes all the way up to 10 meters. Either very close or very strong. VR, Ed Mullin From edwmullin at aol.com Wed Aug 16 20:46:01 2017 From: edwmullin at aol.com (Ed) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2017 20:46:01 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] QRN loud In-Reply-To: <542720F8-6960-4B95-8C6D-4A0966C600ED@aol.com> References: <542720F8-6960-4B95-8C6D-4A0966C600ED@aol.com> Message-ID: <24264793-3B04-42EE-B251-7024DB5929A8@aol.com> Well, it disappeared from 40 and 80 after the sun went down, still a very strong signal above 14 mhz. Can anyone else hear this? VR, Ed Mullin > On Aug 16, 2017, at 8:27 PM, Ed via AMRadio wrote: > > Ive got a new noise source, a pulsing signal that sounds like someone sending an endless string of dashed, with lots of hash. Very string on 80, and goes all the way up to 10 meters. Either very close or very strong. > > VR, Ed Mullin > > > ______________________________________________________________ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to edwmullin at aol.com From edwmullin at aol.com Wed Aug 16 20:52:29 2017 From: edwmullin at aol.com (Ed) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2017 20:52:29 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] QRN loud In-Reply-To: References: <542720F8-6960-4B95-8C6D-4A0966C600ED@aol.com> Message-ID: <6106C046-83C7-4548-BED7-A01BBF830B01@aol.com> Maybe, or a battery charger? Since Im in the city, this could be tough. VR, Ed Mullin > On Aug 16, 2017, at 8:47 PM, Bill Guyger wrote: > > Some kind of motor controller? > > Bill AD5OL > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Aug 16, 2017, at 7:27 PM, Ed via AMRadio wrote: >> >> Ive got a new noise source, a pulsing signal that sounds like someone sending an endless string of dashed, with lots of hash. Very string on 80, and goes all the way up to 10 meters. Either very close or very strong. >> >> VR, Ed Mullin >> >> >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net >> AMRadio mailing list >> Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ >> List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html >> List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio >> Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net >> To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with >> the word unsubscribe in the message body. >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> Message delivered to bguyger at yahoo.com > From w5jo at brightok.net Wed Aug 16 21:22:10 2017 From: w5jo at brightok.net (w5jo at brightok.net) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2017 20:22:10 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Free for postage Message-ID: If anyone is interested, I have a few parts that I will give to someone who wants them for postage and an envelope. 1. B &W audio phase shift network model 350 type 2Q4. And it is in the box like new. 2. Plug, octal type without shell. It is a 9 pin version 3. Plug, octal type without shell it is the 11 pin version. Anyone interested? Jim W5JO From w5jo at brightok.net Wed Aug 16 22:58:59 2017 From: w5jo at brightok.net (w5jo at brightok.net) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2017 21:58:59 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Parts for postage Message-ID: <6487F7FBEA564DC2BF79911B0444B37D@JimPC> The parts I posted earlier have new owners. Thanks all. Jim W5JO From w5jo at brightok.net Fri Aug 18 18:12:51 2017 From: w5jo at brightok.net (w5jo at brightok.net) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2017 17:12:51 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] eclipse Message-ID: https://eyes.jpl.nasa.gov/eyes-on-eclipse-web-app.html From edwmullin at aol.com Sun Aug 20 12:09:03 2017 From: edwmullin at aol.com (Ed) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2017 12:09:03 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Test equipment Message-ID: <29B9CD7C-022A-42C0-8523-E215476B43D6@aol.com> A recent search for a signal generator found one on Amazon with pretty good reviews. My meager bench hosts a few bits of equipment that I use the most, everything else being either too expensive or really just superfluous. Things I couldn't do without: oscilloscope, frequency counter, signal generator, analog multimeter ( an ancient Simpson) and a grid dip meter. I have a heathkit capacitor checker, the type that checks for leakage, but its down and out now. Whats your list of tools you cant live without? VR, Ed Mullin From ne1s at securespeed.us Sun Aug 20 15:01:34 2017 From: ne1s at securespeed.us (Larry Szendrei) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2017 15:01:34 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] Test equipment In-Reply-To: <29B9CD7C-022A-42C0-8523-E215476B43D6@aol.com> References: <29B9CD7C-022A-42C0-8523-E215476B43D6@aol.com> Message-ID: On 8/20/17 12:09 PM, Ed via AMRadio wrote: > A recent search for a signal generator found one on Amazon with pretty good reviews. > > My meager bench hosts a few bits of equipment that I use the most, everything else being either too expensive or really just superfluous. Things I couldn't do without: oscilloscope, frequency counter, signal generator, analog multimeter ( an ancient Simpson) and a grid dip meter. I have a heathkit capacitor checker, the type that checks for leakage, but its down and out now. > > Whats your list of tools you cant live without? > My list is the same as yours, but add a VTVM to it. Mine is a HP 410BR. 73, -Larry/NE1S From kl7fm at yahoo.com Sun Aug 20 15:38:37 2017 From: kl7fm at yahoo.com (KL7FM) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2017 19:38:37 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [AMRadio] Test equipment References: <1710777095.1151211.1503257917587.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1710777095.1151211.1503257917587@mail.yahoo.com> I'd say mine would be my scope, an old Palomar RX Noise bridge, a DVM and added RF probe, a B&W capacitance meter and a few '60s ARRL hand books and of course my trusty HP-35 calculator. Test jigs as necessary... Bob - KL7FM -------------------------------------------- On Sun, 8/20/17, Ed via AMRadio wrote: Subject: [AMRadio] Test equipment To: amradio at mailman.qth.net Date: Sunday, August 20, 2017, 8:09 AM A recent search for a signal generator found one on Amazon with pretty good reviews.? My meager bench hosts a few bits of equipment that I use the most, everything else being either too expensive or really just superfluous.? Things I couldn't do without: oscilloscope, frequency counter, signal generator, analog multimeter ( an ancient Simpson) and a grid dip meter.? I have a heathkit capacitor checker, the type that checks for leakage, but its down and out now. Whats your list of tools you cant live without? VR,? Ed Mullin ______________________________________________________________ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to kl7fm at yahoo.com From k4kyv at charter.net Mon Aug 21 10:34:31 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2017 09:34:31 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] eclipse In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000901d31a8a$9a3bdda0$ceb398e0$@charter.net> We're in path of totality for 2:09 minutes and wx is supposed to be clear all day. 0% POP. Big party in the antenna field with friends and family, excellent viewing spot. Jay, W5JAY may stop by. Don k4kyv > -----Original Message----- > From: amradio-bounces at mailman.qth.net [mailto:amradio- > bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of w5jo at brightok.net > Sent: Friday, 18 August, 2017 17:13 > To: AM Radio List > Subject: [AMRadio] eclipse > > https://eyes.jpl.nasa.gov/eyes-on-eclipse-web-app.html > __________________________________________________________ > ____ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message > delivered to k4kyv at charter.net --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From mharmon at att.net Mon Aug 21 11:19:36 2017 From: mharmon at att.net (Michael D. Harmon) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2017 10:19:36 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] Test Equipment Message-ID: <0adddff9-177d-3ae0-6ea0-147a866af90b@att.net> I have to say that I have been fortunate in locating gear for my bench.? The majority of pieces came in inoperable condition.? I managed to scrounge up junk carcasses or "parts" units to steal parts from to get a unit up and running.? I love working on stuff, especially test gear and old tube-type amateur gear, so I sorta look at it all as a labor of love.? I'm 67 and have been building and fixing stuff all my life.? I've been licensed since 1968, and have seen a LOT of technology changes in the past 50 years! Right now, I'd have to say the most used items on my bench are my Tek 7904A scope, various power supplies, DVM, frequency counters (HP 5340A and Leader LDC-824S), signal generators (HP 8640B and SG-1144), Ballantine 323 AC voltmeter, Boonton 91H RF voltmeter and Millen 90662A grid dip meter (complete set of LF/MF/HF/VHF coils). I have quite a bit of homebrew gear as well.? I have just found a Spectracom 8197 GPSDO to keep everything on frequency, but I don't have the antenna up yet.? I spend WAY more time at the bench than I do on the air! That's my two cents' worth! Mike, WB0LDJ mharmon at att dot net From randyn3lrx at gmail.com Mon Aug 21 11:24:06 2017 From: randyn3lrx at gmail.com (Randy Berry) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2017 11:24:06 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] eclipse In-Reply-To: <000901d31a8a$9a3bdda0$ceb398e0$@charter.net> References: <000901d31a8a$9a3bdda0$ceb398e0$@charter.net> Message-ID: I'll be in a partial at 14:25 EDT / 18:25 UTC. WX is supposed to be partly sunny. I'm going to try to stay up to see what I can of it, but I worked all night and I'm dozing at my desk. Maybe I'll get a second wind here soon. Randy, N3LRX/8 On Mon, Aug 21, 2017 at 10:34 AM, Donald Chester wrote: > We're in path of totality for 2:09 minutes and wx is supposed to be clear > all day. 0% POP. Big party in the antenna field with friends and family, > excellent viewing spot. Jay, W5JAY may stop by. > > Don k4kyv > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: amradio-bounces at mailman.qth.net [mailto:amradio- >> bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of w5jo at brightok.net >> Sent: Friday, 18 August, 2017 17:13 >> To: AM Radio List >> Subject: [AMRadio] eclipse >> >> https://eyes.jpl.nasa.gov/eyes-on-eclipse-web-app.html From wb4aeg at zoho.com Mon Aug 21 11:26:09 2017 From: wb4aeg at zoho.com (Hal Dale) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2017 11:26:09 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] eclipse In-Reply-To: References: <000901d31a8a$9a3bdda0$ceb398e0$@charter.net> Message-ID: <15e0566aeeb.f172824c114767.6470272735234951680@zoho.com> Hal/WB4AEG here...I'll be listening 1812 and 3528CW and watching the REV bcn. Will be interesting... ---- On Mon, 21 Aug 2017 11:24:06 -0400 Randy Berry <randyn3lrx at gmail.com> wrote ---- I'll be in a partial at 14:25 EDT / 18:25 UTC. WX is supposed to be partly sunny. I'm going to try to stay up to see what I can of it, but I worked all night and I'm dozing at my desk. Maybe I'll get a second wind here soon. Randy, N3LRX/8 On Mon, Aug 21, 2017 at 10:34 AM, Donald Chester <k4kyv at charter.net> wrote: > We're in path of totality for 2:09 minutes and wx is supposed to be clear > all day. 0% POP. Big party in the antenna field with friends and family, > excellent viewing spot. Jay, W5JAY may stop by. > > Don k4kyv > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: amradio-bounces at mailman.qth.net [mailto:amradio- >> bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of w5jo at brightok.net >> Sent: Friday, 18 August, 2017 17:13 >> To: AM Radio List <amradio at mailman.qth.net> >> Subject: [AMRadio] eclipse >> >> https://eyes.jpl.nasa.gov/eyes-on-eclipse-web-app.html ______________________________________________________________ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Archives: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/amradio/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio at mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-request at mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to wb4aeg at zoho.com From mjcal77 at yahoo.com Mon Aug 21 18:00:44 2017 From: mjcal77 at yahoo.com (CL in NC) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2017 22:00:44 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [AMRadio] Test equipment References: <2099278103.43354.1503352844210.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2099278103.43354.1503352844210@mail.yahoo.com> I'd add a really good DVM, one that does well with less than 1 ohm readings. Nothing can speed short finding than a meter like that where you can just follow the decreasing resistance as it goes in the milli-ohm range to the short without having to lift wires or suspect parts. I invested in a good signal generator, an old style service monitor that I got govt surplus and a Tek scope. The rest of my stuff is Eico and Heathkit tube test equipment I built from kits 50 years ago, and a 'newer' Heath counter from around 40 years ago. Charlie, W4MEC in NC From k4kyv at charter.net Mon Aug 21 19:46:01 2017 From: k4kyv at charter.net (Donald Chester) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2017 18:46:01 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] eclipse In-Reply-To: <15e0566aeeb.f172824c114767.6470272735234951680@zoho.com> References: <000901d31a8a$9a3bdda0$ceb398e0$@charter.net> <15e0566aeeb.f172824c114767.6470272735234951680@zoho.com> Message-ID: <000701d31ad7$a51935e0$ef4ba1a0$@charter.net> > Hal/WB4AEG here...I'll be listening 1812 and 3528CW and watching the REV > bcn. Will be interesting... I listened shortly after totality. Didn't hear anything on 160m, but tuned to the top end of the AM broadcast band, and heard several stations between 1600 and 1700, kind of like on a midwinter day. Didn't listen long enough to ID any one, but there was a particularly strong one around 1640 or 1650. An hour or so later that segment of the band was completely devoid of any signals whatever. Excellent viewing conditions here. Totality lasted 2 min 9 seconds, and the sky was 100% clear. Those in the path of totality who didn't bother to prepare for viewing the real thing and watched it on TV or the computer, missed an experience of a lifetime: the spectacular 360? panoramic "sunset", the cooling off of the broiling heat, the wind patterns and overall look of the sky and horizon during totality. I didn't see any stars, but Venus was brilliantly visible. What made it even more impressive is that we got to see it from here amidst familiar surroundings, catching subtleties that might not have been noticed by those travelling to unfamiliar settings to catch totality. We made a nice party out of it, with family and friends totalling about 20 people, including Jay W5JAY and his lovely wife. Don k4kyv --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From ranchorobbo at gmail.com Mon Aug 21 19:57:03 2017 From: ranchorobbo at gmail.com (Rob Atkinson) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2017 18:57:03 -0500 Subject: [AMRadio] eclipse In-Reply-To: <000701d31ad7$a51935e0$ef4ba1a0$@charter.net> References: <000901d31a8a$9a3bdda0$ceb398e0$@charter.net> <15e0566aeeb.f172824c114767.6470272735234951680@zoho.com> <000701d31ad7$a51935e0$ef4ba1a0$@charter.net> Message-ID: I went out into the parking lot at work at 1:15 p.m. Central Time and tried listening with my car radio to 650, 750 and 1510. I am about 40 miles west of Chicago. With the car omni directional antenna it was a bust. locals on 750 and QRM from 670. I had my GE Superadio and Grundig Yachtboy rx. I can normally null 670 with the Superadio loopstick but for some reason was unable to this time. Must have been my location. I had better luck on 160 and 75 with the Yachtboy and telescoping antenna. On the low end of 160 the "Solar Eclipse QSO Party" was going on and I copied K5NA in Texas and WD5R in Arkansas on 1822 and 1816 respectively. That was around the time of maximum solar coverage here, 1:20 p.m. Heard what must have been that AM bulletin station in Missouri on 1860 but the guy running it didn't ID much--He should have been running an ID every 30 seconds or less. For about 3 or 4 minutes he was solid copy then suddenly faded into the noise before I could get a confirmed ID. Tuned across 80 m. On 75, Heard some SSB and WB8UHZ working K8ATV on 3880 and WB8BFS on 3885. No CW. By then it was around 1:35 and I shut it all down and went back to work. I'd say that for summer conditions and the way the low bands have been in the daytime, this was unusual daytime propagation and the eclipse must have had something to do with it. I may have heard WLAC on 1510 but didn't get an ID. Watt, down near Nashville reported copying a number of Chicago clears down there plus KMOX and WTAM if I remember right. It was cloudy here except for a few minutes during which people could see the sun. I didn't have any special lenses and didn't directly see it but didn't mind because I was more interested in RF propagation. Rob K5UJ From wa2oax at toast.net Tue Aug 29 10:39:21 2017 From: wa2oax at toast.net (Ira Lipton) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2017 10:39:21 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] radios for sale Message-ID: I'm selling off my heavier radios including: Johnson KW desk (amp only) Collins 310B-3 (used as a driver for the Johnson KW) 75A1 75A2 32V2 Please check my ad on eham and contact me off reflector if you have any interest in the gear. The radios will need to be picked up in Liberty, NY (2 hours north of NYC). 73, Ira WA2OAX From wa2oax at toast.net Tue Aug 29 14:06:32 2017 From: wa2oax at toast.net (Ira Lipton) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2017 14:06:32 -0400 Subject: [AMRadio] correction Message-ID: My equipment ad is posted on qth.com, not eham. Ira WA2OAX

This page last updated 23 Oct 2017.